MMA Who is the Mike Tyson of MMA

Discussion in 'OT Bar' started by Optamix, Aug 31, 2007.

  1. Optamix

    Optamix New Member

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    And by that I mean just complete and utter wasted talent.

    I'm gonna have to go with Mark Kerr. Seeing his old fights just makes me sad :sadwavey:
     
  2. whup

    whup I wish you had children and.. so that I could step

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    Belfort came to mind for me.

    And Fedor if he doesn't go to the UFC /deadhorse
     
  3. konrad109

    konrad109 New Member

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    Randleman of course.
     
  4. SCirone

    SCirone Moderator

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  5. jmx2323

    jmx2323 OT Supporter

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    belfort came right to my mind. I see Kerr but I dont see Aleks on that list though, he hasnt lost to anybody who he should have beat other then maybe Werdrum...a loss to Barnett and Mirko are not hard losses to take
     
  6. Optamix

    Optamix New Member

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    I agree, I don't see Aleks as a waste of talent. I think he is still improving and will still make waves in a HW division(where ever he ends up).

    IMO Mike Tyson was the greatest boxer of all time. But he could have solidified that for several more years. He stopped training and had a horrible personal life. Boxing kind of died with with his career. He was the last great champion.
     
  7. Savage5point0

    Savage5point0 Im an asshole.

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    He was basically exploited by Don King. If Custamato had not died things would be a lot different. Mike was never the same after that, he had no mentor, no guidance.

    As a huge Tyson fan I have to say he wasnt the greatest of all time. Gonna have to go with Ray Robinson.

    Facts (from wiki):

    -Robinson was 85-0 as an amateur
    -Robinson engaged in 200 pro bouts, and his professional career lasted nearly 26 years
    -Robinson was named the greatest fighter of the 20th century by the Associated Press, and the greatest boxer in history by ESPN.com in 2007
    -Muhammad Ali, who repeatedly called himself "The Greatest" throughout his career, ranked Robinson as the greatest pound for pound boxer of all time.
    -First boxer in history to win a divisional world championship five times
     
  8. checkii

    checkii ฝรั่งตาน้ำข้าว

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    some CBS guy wrote a surprisingly very good article on this exact topic. ranked the biggest wastes of talent in MMA


    10. Alistair Overeem: The Dutch-born kickboxer is a tremendous athlete who has lost to the likes of Chuck Liddell, Mauricio "Shogun" Rua (twice), Ricardo Arona, Antonio Rogerio Nogueira, and Fabricio Werdum. On the verge of breaking into the world's elite at 205 pounds, it seemed like the only thing that prevented Overeem from doing so was his lack of conditioning. After a 14-fight career in Pride, he is now competing for K-1's MMA promotion, Hero's. The problem is that Overeem is just fighting to keep himself relevant in MMA when he should be fighting to prove that he's one of the sport's best.

    9. Carter Williams: Williams shocked the kickboxing world in 2003 when he won K-1's U.S. Grand Prix at the age of 23. Entering the tournament as an 18-to-1 underdog, Williams took out the likes of Michael McDonald, Rick Roufus and Dewey Cooper on the way to the tournament title. The sky appeared to be the limit for Williams following his strong showing, but he's never come close to reaching his full potential in the years since. His disappointing ways have carried over into MMA when he showed up 20 pounds overweight for his June 22 bout on the undercard of the Frank Shamrock vs. Phil Baroni main event. Williams was knocked out by Paul Buentello at 0:10 into the second round and it was later revealed he had tested positive for cocaine during a pre-fight drug screening. If "The Beast" spent less time at the club and more time at the gym, there's no telling how far he could go.

    8. Kevin Randleman: Considered a contemporary to fellow former standout college wrestlers such as Randy Couture and Mark Coleman, Randleman has failed to achieve even a small fraction of the success that they've accomplished in MMA. Randleman's downfall has been his insistence of relying almost exclusively on his world class wrestling ability. If he had devoted himself to a standup discipline he would have matched Coleman and Couture's level of success. Currently on suspension by the Nevada State Athletic Commission after attempting to cheat a urine test, Randleman is rumored to be mounting a comeback while training under the guidance of Shawn Tompkins. Tompkins is currently one of the best striking coaches in MMA and could be exactly what Randleman needs.

    7. Frank Mir: Once the poster boy of the UFC's heavyweight division, Mir is currently known more for his excellent work as a commentator on WEC WrekCage on the Versus network. Mir hasn't been the same since being involved in a serious motorcycle accident several years back and based on his appearance during his comeback fights, looks to have slacked off on his conditioning. Few heavyweights have better submission skills than Mir so it would be a mistake to write him off just yet. Unfortunately, the clock is ticking, and if he doesn't show something against kickboxing standout Antoni Hardonk at UFC 74 on Aug. 25, then it might be time for Mir to focus solely on his broadcasting career.

    6. Evan Tanner: An original Team Quest member, Tanner is a well-rounded fighter with good submission wrestling and strong boxing skills. Unfortunately, personal demons outside of the fight game have derailed a brilliant career that has seen Tanner not only hold the UFC middleweight title but also defeat Phil Baroni, Robbie Lawler, Paul Buentello, Heath Herring and David Terrell. Now 36, time is not on Tanner's side. However, there still could be time for one more run at the title; he's reportedly back in training with Chute Boxe USA and might be making a comeback in the UFC this September.

    5. David Loiseau: A talented striker who has a rare ability of defending himself when he gives his back to a fighter, Loiseau was on top of the world following a TKO victory over Evan Tanner at UFC Fight Night 2 in October of 2005. However, "The Crow" has been caught in a downward spiral ever since, beginning with a lackluster performance against Rich Franklin during a UFC middleweight title bout at UFC 58. Loiseau was then unceremoniously dropped by the UFC following another tentative effort during a unanimous decision loss to Mike Swick at UFC 63. Things seemed to be turning around for him after signing a lucrative three-fight deal with EliteXC. However, Loiseau looked like he was sleep walking during yet another unanimous decision loss, this time against Joey Villasenor at EliteXC's debut card on February 10. After snapping a three fight losing streak while fighting for the Art of War promotion on May 11, Loiseau will look to rebuild his once promising career. He's still only 27 and has been relatively injury free during his career. As such, there's a realistic opportunity for him to regain everything he lost so long as he starts fighting aggressively again.

    4. Yves Edwards: Watching Edwards in person compete for Bodog Fight in Trenton, N.J. on July 14 triggered a range of emotions as I watched him enter the ring to fight Jorge Masvidal. A personal favorite for several years, I was excited just for the chance to see Edwards fight but was depressed that he was doing so in an arena that was only one third full. Once one of the top lightweight strikers in the world, I was at a loss when trying to figure out why he wasn't competing for the UFC lightweight title in the middle of a packed arena. My perplexed state ended after Edwards was knocked out at 2:19 into the second round following a high kick by Masvidal. With five losses in his past six fights, Edwards needs to do some soul searching and see if he can get back to being the fighter who holds wins over the likes of Hermes Franca (twice), Josh Thomson, Rich Clementi and Dokonjonosuke Mishima.


    3. Joe Riggs: The inspiration for this column, Riggs is considered a beast when it comes to training. When I hear fighters who have trained with Riggs talk about him, they describe him as a future world champion. Injuries and issues outside of the cage have no doubt held him back, but there has to be a bigger reason why the fighter so many others have raved about comes up small in actual fights. Only 24, it's way too early in the game to write off a guy who once weighed over 300 pounds and has also had to deal with the death of an infant child. If Riggs can stay healthy, fight exclusively as a middleweight and remain focused, there's no reason why he still can't develop into an elite fighter. The tools are all there, he just needs to utilize them.

    2. B.J. Penn: You might be asking, what is one of the best pound-for-pound fighters in the world doing on this list? But that's the issue; why are we talking about him as one of the best and not the best?

    Penn is the Roy Jones Jr. of MMA: he's a multi-dimensional fighter capable of being dominant in multiple weight classes. Like Jones, Penn possesses a level of athletic prowess unrivaled by most of his peers.

    If Penn dedicated himself to conditioning to the extent he did in his preparation for his fight against Jens Pulver at the TUF 5 finale he'd be capable of being the first fighter in history of holding the lightweight, welterweight and middleweight title on a simultaneous basis. There might be those who consider that a melodramatic statement, but how many fighters are out there who posses both Abu Dhabi grappling ability and K-1 standup skills?

    1. Vitor Belfort: In addition to being a former UFC light heavyweight champion, Belfort also holds career victories over Tank Abbott, Wanderlei Silva, Gilbert Yvel, Heath Herring, Marvin Eastman and Randy Couture (due to a cut from an inadvertent thumb poke). His list of career losses is even more impressive and includes Couture, Chuck Liddell, Tito Ortiz, and Dan Henderson. The bottom line is that Belfort was at one juncture a big time fighter who fought in big time fights.

    The fact that so many pundits talk about him in the past tense speaks volumes because he's only 30. If Belfort had solved the mental aspect of fighting we might be referring to him as the top 205-pound fighter in the world. He's one of the best natural boxers in the light heavyweight division and received a black belt in Jiu-Jitsu from Carlson Gracie.

    His next fight is scheduled for Sept. 22, but it won't be for the UFC in Anaheim, Calif. Instead, he'll be headlining for the UK-based Cage Rage promotion. There's still plenty of time for him to get it together and make another run, but it's unlikely to happen for a major promotion in North America. That's because Belfort tested positive for steroids following his loss to Henderson at Pride 32 and defied the Nevada State Athletic Commission's mandate by fighting before fully serving his nine-month suspension.
     
  9. adrenalin112

    adrenalin112 New Member

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    Referring to a fighter as being mike Tyson like is a huge insult. Tyson was an embarrassment in life by becoming a convicted rapist and in the ring by getting knocked out by cans and even resorting to biting his opponents. He's a huge black eye for his sport. With that said... I'd say that the two most qualified for the Tyson title would be:

    Crazyhorse and Carter Williams

    Both have world class athletic prowess and continue to embarrass themselves with their poor performances. I can see them both embracing failure and getting locked up (again for crazyhorse).
     
  10. checkii

    checkii ฝรั่งตาน้ำข้าว

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    add melvin guillard to that pair and you have the holy trinity of wasted talent.

    black people really need more people to root for in mma.
     
  11. checkii

    checkii ฝรั่งตาน้ำข้าว

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    Terry and his african awesomeness more than makes up for all the cokeheads.
     
  12. GhostRidah

    GhostRidah Call Kenny Loggins because you're in the danger zo

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    Well if you go for biting people then Gilbert Yvel
     
  13. roose

    roose Guest

    Biggest waste of talent is BJ Penn soley because he has the most to waste.
     
  14. 2ofdem

    2ofdem OT Supporter

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    Kerr
    The similaritys

    natural talent and the physical tools to use it.
    Women and Drugs fucked his head up.
    Was once at the top of the game and slid down the rankings due to his mental issue not his physical ability.
     
  15. Atmosphere

    Atmosphere PURPLE DREAM

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    Kerr or Mir
     
  16. Optamix

    Optamix New Member

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    At least Mir has the "a car fucking ran into me" excuse.
     
  17. 2ofdem

    2ofdem OT Supporter

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    Kerr probably had a car run into him also but he didnt notice as he was off his head.
     
  18. Atmosphere

    Atmosphere PURPLE DREAM

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    that put him out of commission for awhile, but that doesn't excuse his laziness from training
     
  19. apman0000

    apman0000 OT Supporter

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    how is tyson a waste of talent, guy was a dominate heavyweight and made millions and was champion of the world.

    the fact that he then blew his money and went to prison is a waste of life and money not talent.
     
  20. Optamix

    Optamix New Member

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    He wasn't near as dominant as he could have been. He barely trained after his manager/trainer/mentor died. Its a shame really. He was only 21 when he unified the belts.
     
  21. 2ofdem

    2ofdem OT Supporter

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    He could have dominated the HW division for 20years he dominated it for 2 years.
     
  22. 3x

    3x New Member

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    If Kevin Randleman had trained with anyone else other than hammer house he would have been the best Ever.
     
  23. checkii

    checkii ฝรั่งตาน้ำข้าว

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    not a chance.
     
  24. The Ripper

    The Ripper New Member

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    he was the last person to be able to effectively use the dempsey roll. that in and of itself is a feat. The conditioning and skill that you need to pull that shit off is incredible. He is definately up there with the legends like rocky marciano jack dempsey and all the old school blood and guts inside fighters. I actually think its a toss up between him and marciano as to who the best inside fighter of all time is.

    I dont think mike is a waste of talent because he did accomplish alot and made it to the top. He stayed there for awhile what happened to him like with alot of pro atletes is he couldnt handle being at the top and he surrounded himself with all of the wrong people and thats what eventually led to his downfall as a fighter. As a human being he was always a peice of shit. He didnt waste his talents though he did what he had to do in his time frame and untill he lost to buster douglass he was on top of the world.

    former wba ibf and wbc hw champion he was the youngest heavy weight champion at 20 years and 4 months

    50 wins 44 kos and he lost 6 times. Thats a hell of a record. I dont think mike tyson cane really be listed as an under achiever because in his time he achieved a hell of alot
     
  25. The Ripper

    The Ripper New Member

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    yeah I would have like to have seen alot more from vitor belfort he had all of the tools to become one of the greats and back then he used to be one of my favorite fighters but he had to much other shit going on and his personal life and other projects kept him from being one of the greatests in mma. I think he could have been better if he had more drive and focus for the sport. Things that fucked him up were

    1. loss of his sister alot of people said thats really what killed his career.
    2. taking breaks to try and become part of the brazilian boxing team
    3. taking breaks to be part of brazilian soap operas.

    I know vitor is trying to make a come back now. He won a fight in april and now he is getting ready to fight for the cage rage title around the end of the month. So hopefully he does end up winning this and it could be the begining of him reviving his career. Even though I dont see him going very far if he stays with cage rage he might be able to use the exposure to rebuild his career and then sighn on with a bigger promo like elite xc , strike force or bodog.
     

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