GUN what would you do in this situation....

Discussion in 'On Topic' started by BlackdeathM3, Feb 27, 2007.

  1. BlackdeathM3

    BlackdeathM3 ************************

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    ok, last night I was going to bed, about 12:30, I have this habit of looking out the blinds one last time before I get in the bed. we live in a neighborhood, I've lived in the country all my life, still getting used to living next to people.

    well, I look outside and there are 3 kids, probably 16-20 standing in the middle of the street, one looks like he's drinking beer. after about a second, they start walking up my street, going right past my cars. I am just waiting for them to start trying to break into one of them. I stand there, just watching, and they just kept walking, and finnaly got out of my line of sight down the road. I just get uneasy about people messing with my stuff, I've had cars broken into before.

    now, as I am laying there trying to get to sleep, I keep playing out senerios(sp?) in my head. One of which goes like this.

    Say, I saw them go up in my driveway, which is only like 25 feet long, and start breaking into my car. What I had in mind was to step out my front door, with my loaded shotgun, and yell at them to freeze while my wife calls the cops. Now, if they ran away, they ran away, I understand I am outside of my house now, and basicly the shotgun is a scare tatic, if I shoot at them I go to jail forsure. BUT, what if one of the guys turns into billy badass and starts coming at me. I can pretty much tell he is unarmed, but he is still going to attack me. Now what sucks is I know if I shoot him with my 12 gauge, with buck shot in it, there is a really good chance I am going to kill this guy. What should I do? Shoot? I just kept playing this sceene in my head over and over again, and I couldn't figure out what I would have done. If he doesn't have a weapon he isn't indangering my life 100%, beating me up isn't going to kill me most likely, and we are outside my house. If we were inside my house, even if he had nothing but fists he is getting his head blown off.

    what would you guys do? I am a noob and gun laws, etc. I live in NC if anybody knows the laws here, I heard about in texas if you catch someone doing the above you have the right to blow them away, but I'm not sure about NC.
     
  2. Sarge21

    Sarge21 Frau am Steuer Ungeheuer!

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    dunno about the gun laws in NC but...


    That's a tricky situation, if I knew FOR SURE that the men were unarmed I would not have brought the gun outside. I would have instead chose a more non-lethal weapon (katana sword for example), or nothing at all (i'm a self-defense instructor) because just by coming outside you probably would have scared them off. However, since you can never know for sure if someone is armed or unarmed, I likely would have gone outside armed with my 1911. Then, if he started coming after me and was unarmed, a couple of things could happen:

    -I could choose not to shoot the unarmed man and instead take the chance of handling him hand-to-hand but then risk that he gains control of the weapon and uses it on me.

    - I could shoot to kill and likely go to jail.


    - I could shoot to maim and justify myself in court that I had sufficient reason to believe such force was necessary to stop the threat (he was, after all, attempting to attack an armed individual)

    -Fire a warning shot into the ground and hope it scares him off and possibly get a citation for negligent discharge.



    If it were me, and this person was crazy enough to come at me when i am armed and he is unarmed, that in itself is enough reason for me to fear for my life and I would likely shoot to maim. But with adrenaline and all that going you run the definate risk of overreacting.



    This all brings us back to the addage "dont pull your gun if your not willing to use it". For this reason among others, I always have other options for weapons and diffusing situations if they dont call for the lethality of a firearm.


    just my .02
     
  3. BlackdeathM3

    BlackdeathM3 ************************

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    true, true. i know all about not pulling the gun unless you are ready to use it. would just suck if I brought a baseball bat to a gun fight though. almost think this is just a loose/loose situation.
     
  4. Sarge21

    Sarge21 Frau am Steuer Ungeheuer!

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    get a pistol and have that on you in case of emergency?

    If things escalate, drop the bat and pull the gun. There is nothing that says you can have a bat in hand and the grip of a gun sticking out of your waistband.
     
  5. Sarge21

    Sarge21 Frau am Steuer Ungeheuer!

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    you do realize i live in florida right :rofl:
     
  6. Sarge21

    Sarge21 Frau am Steuer Ungeheuer!

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    but i do 100% agree with calling the police right off the bat and i'm an idiot for not saying that. You did however, already mention that in your original post.
     
  7. Pineapple Devil

    Pineapple Devil beat it!

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    call police
    turn on porch light
    open the door and yell at them
    /end scenario

    no need to take a gun into it b/c 99.9% of the people will run if they know someone has seen them. taking a gun into that situation is asking for trouble
     
  8. 90free400e

    90free400e New Member

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    1) North Carolina Common Law
    Use of force to protect a person
    (1) Justified Self-Defense

    A citizen is legally justified in using deadly force against another only if: (a) The citizen actually believes deadly force is necessary to prevent an imminent threat of death, great bodily harm, or sexual assault and
    (b) The facts and circumstances prompting that belief would cause a person of ordinary firmness to believe deadly force was necessary to prevent an imminent threat of death, great bodily harm, or sexual assault, and
    (c) The person using deadly force was not an instigator or aggressor who voluntarily provoked, entered, or continued the conflict leading to deadly force, and
    (d) Force used was not excessive - greater than reasonably needed to overcome the threat posed by a hostile aggressor. (2) Duty To Retreat Before Using Deadly Force Unless and exception such as those listed below applies, a citizen must retreat before using deadly force if retreat is possible.
    Exception
    A. There is no duty to retreat before using deadly force if the assault threatens imminent death or great bodily harm - a murderous or felonious assault or sexual assault.
    Exception
    B. There is no duty to retreat before using deadly force if the victim is on his or her own premises, or on his or her business premises, or is at home. (4) Deadly Force in Defence of Others
    A Citizen may intervene and use deadly force in defence of another person when, under the facts and circumstances, it reasonably appeared necessary to save the other person from imminent threat of death, great bodily harm, or sexual assault but only to the extent the other person was entitled to use deadly force in self-defence.
    (5) Deadly Force MAY NOT Be Used:
    (a) To Stop a Simple Assault.The exact point in time a simple assault becomes deadly is often unclear. Repeated blows to vital body areas, choking, continued beating on a helpless or weakened victim, are some indicators.
    (b) Because of the Use of Violent Language § 14-277.1. Communicating threats.
    (c)] Because You Are a Victim of Past Violence and Fear Future Violence
    (d) Because a Trespasser Refuses to Leave
    (e) To Arrest a Criminal or to Prevent a Criminal's Escape
    b. Use of force to protect property
    The law does not permit the use of deadly force solely to protect property, or to prevent
    theft, or to regain stolen property. An owner CANNOT shoot at a thief - before, during, or
    after a theft. The same rule prohibits deadly force to prevent injury or vandalism to property. A different rule applies if life is imminently threatened at the same time property is taken. Deadly force used to prevent an armed robbery is force used to protect life, not to protect property.
     
  9. Sarge21

    Sarge21 Frau am Steuer Ungeheuer!

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    everything I said falls completely in line with my states self-defense laws.
     
  10. sprite

    sprite Active Member

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    1) Call cops.
    2) Open window.
    3) Yell "The cops are on the way"
    4) Close window.
    5) Wait for cops.

    99.9% of the time the kids are going to haul ass. If you're unlucky enough to get stuck dealing with the 0.1% that are going to try to attack you between steps 4 & 5, then you will be in the safety of your home. If they forcibly break into your home, you are 100% justified to protect yourself and family using whatever means necessary.

    If you step outside, armed or otherwise, into a situation where it is dark, you are knowingly out-numbered, dealing with people who may or may not be armed, and may or may not be intoxicated/high/psychotic, then you get whatever is coming to you regardless of what your states laws may say.
     
  11. Small Block LSX

    Small Block LSX BMW | N54 | LSX | Gun | PS3 | Parent | Night CREW

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    Does anyone know the Minnesota law? Or, can someone look it up and post a link. :)
     
  12. Sarge21

    Sarge21 Frau am Steuer Ungeheuer!

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    a) you obviously didnt read my entire post with any kind of diligence

    b) the laws changed here in 2005. You obviously didnt read my post where i listed them.

    c) all situations i have encountered where being outnumbered I have successfuly diffused without ever having to resort to violence. For the rare occasion where there was a physical confrontation, I can handle myself.

    d) Threatening with a sword is not deadly force, it's simply an effective intimidant. Actually using it is another story. The same can be said of a bat, club, etc...

    e) In the case of most automobile break-ins, the perpetrators are never caught and the damage has to be pawned of to insurance, if your insurance even covers that. I will excercise my right to protect my property thanks.
     
  13. Sarge21

    Sarge21 Frau am Steuer Ungeheuer!

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    notice that when i said shoot to maime, I stipulated that the guy was coming at me trying to attack me, thus giving me the reason to fear great bodily harm.

    If an unarmed person is attempting to steal/break into personal property and advances in a threatening manner at the armed person attempting to protect his personal property, the situation has changed from property protection to bodily protection. It can be assumed that attacker is meaning to inflict serious bodily harm on the property owner and will not stop with simply the "threat" of a weapon.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2007
  14. TL1000RSquid

    TL1000RSquid ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

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    Then you shoot to kill.
     
  15. Sarge21

    Sarge21 Frau am Steuer Ungeheuer!

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    I'm doing that this weekend actually
     
  16. Gimik

    Gimik New Member

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    The point is, they are BOTH deadly weapons. You're trading one deadly weapon for another (less effective) one.

    Being confident that you can diffuse a situation where you are outmanned and possibly/probably outgunned does not seem like a great idea to me - especially since you just dropped your gun and picked up a sword.

    And there is no such thing as shooting to maime. Any shot can be possibly leathal. Not to mention with some trick shot attempt, you're much more likely to miss and hit something you're not intending to. Center mass until the threat has ended.

    These are a lot of bad ideas.
     
  17. spankaveli

    spankaveli OT Supporter

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    you did the right thing. they were doing nothing wrong that i can see and they did nothing to you. now, had they approached the vehicles, i'd have called the police and told them there were several persons by in your driveway and they appear to be drinking and then grab my pistol, holster it, grab a bat or something and walk outside, not acting threatening but just ask them to go about their business.
     
  18. BlackdeathM3

    BlackdeathM3 ************************

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    thanks for the advice guys, didn't mean for this to turn into a pissing match

    guess I'll take from this to turn the lights on and call the cops.

    obviously shoot to kill if they enter your house, dead people can't talk to the police or sue you. maimed people can.
     
  19. copperhead035

    copperhead035 New Member

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    If nothing else, you said they looked underage and drinking beer, in the street? That right there is open container, public intox, underage consumption, and depending on your area possibly a curfew violation. You could have called the cops on that alone.
     
  20. TL1000RSquid

    TL1000RSquid ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

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    If there not causing trouble and not being loud why be a dick
     
  21. Grouch

    Grouch Guest

    Jesus Christ the kids weren't even doing anything and the first reaction is get the gun or call the cops.
     
  22. Thunderbear

    Thunderbear Yggdrasil's Forester.

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    fixed. Squid, ya oughtta know better. :p
     
  23. Aequitas

    Aequitas If it keeps on raining, levee's going to break.

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    Sounds like the op just needs to get used to living around people. Then again, you get used to people outside your place at all hours of the night living in an apartment complex geared toward college kids.
     
  24. TL1000RSquid

    TL1000RSquid ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

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    Same thing.
    "I was in fear of my life that why I emptied the magazine in his chest" :mamoru:
     
  25. BlackdeathM3

    BlackdeathM3 ************************

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    well, I really didn't care if they were having gay sex in the street, as long as they didn't mess with my stuff.
     

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