Uhh ohh.. Maaco. Continued. Progress pics and questions

Discussion in 'That'll Buff Right Out' started by Mycophiles, Dec 16, 2009.

  1. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    Today I started sanding the car. Using 320grit wet sandpaper I sanded the entire hood until smooth to the the touch. I haven't gone over with 600 grit yet. I am going to do all the panels than need 320 grit first. If you look at the pictures you will see that there are rock chips all over the front... even waaay up the hood. There is not rust and they are not down to the metal (only primer) but I was wondering what I needed to do with them. There are quite a few.

    On to the pics.

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    This is the trunk. I had a question about what to do about the paint flaking off but did a search and figured out I need to go to bare metal on the panel. (to do it right ;-) )

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Anyway. It's not extremely difficult. Arms a bit tired and there's no need to hit the gym that's for sure.

    I was wondering if I needed to do 320grit on the entire car or only the panels with the clearcoat problem. Do I do 600 grit on the rest of the car?

    Also, at the pawn shop I saw a black and decker sander/polisher for 40 bucks (electrical) Is it worth it to grab it or will by-hand be better?

    Advice, comments VERY welcome.
     
  2. Priest Tango

    Priest Tango Custom User Tits

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    feather them. gotta feather the edges.
     
  3. BlazinBlazer Guy

    BlazinBlazer Guy Witness to The De-Evolution of Mankind.

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    If we're being realistic, how much are you actually saving by doing the prep on this yourself?
     
  4. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    Well... good question. Maaco does no prep work at all so if I take the car there I'd say I'm saving a ton. But I've also gone to a shop down the street and he quoted me around 900$ The maaco job is 500 without clearcoat the 900$ job is with clearcoat if I do the prep myself. I'd quess I'm saving 3-400$. Plus.. I talked to the guy at the second shop... since we are doing 2 cars I'm pretty sure he is going to cut us a deal if he steals the sale from maaco. And honestly.. I don't mind doing the work. I like getting the experience and I have the time right now as I'm between school semesters.

    I found a dewalt DA sander at a pawn shop for 40$.

    I thought it was a DA... turns out to be this.

    http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=311347-70-DW845&lpage=none

    but had a speed variation option on it. Not a DA but would still work am I right?

    edit: Also I find it interesting that wikipedia says that Random Orbital sanders and Duel Action sanders are the same thing. Why can't I use my RA Sander for the car. I'm using it for the trunk to go down to the metal but why not for the wet-sanding also?
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2009
  5. BlazinBlazer Guy

    BlazinBlazer Guy Witness to The De-Evolution of Mankind.

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    I wouldn't use a rotary tool to sand down your substrate, unless you're planning to grind it to bare metal with 80 or 120 grit.

    That's a matter of opinion. There are multiple schools of thought on classifying "random orbital" and "dual action" sanders/polishers. Mine is this:

    Random Orbital = tool that "jiggles" with no set path. Essentially an electric or air-driven human hand that works significantly faster than a human hand.

    Dual Action = tool that "jiggles" similarly to an RO tool, but also has some manner of forced rotation, creating a more consistent result on the work surface. True DA machines also usually have more torque and create a faster result than an RO tool.

    When you refer to an RO sander you already have, I imagine you're referring to something like this:

    [​IMG]

    You probably can get away with something of this sort IF you're going down to bare metal. Otherwise, that's a woodworking tool, and the sanding marks you'll have left behind most likely WILL show through your new paint.



    However, all of that aside, my biggest concern is what I'm seeing in the pics you posted. Even on the hood where you have sanded it smooth, the mottling from clear and basecoat failure is likely going to show through the new paint job unless you're having a sealer coat applied and blocked prior to the base/clear. The same will be true of the rock chips you say are still there.

    I haven't heard you mention having a high-build primer/sealer applied to the car, but in order to prep this "right" you really need to have a coat applied to the car after you've sanded down all the rough spots in the existing finish, and then block that with 320 grit dry before the base/clear is applied.

    You might want to have the shop that is going to paint the car for you take a look and advise you of what prep work they'd recommend you to do to ensure a satisfactory finished result.
     
  6. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    Cool.. Luis is the guy I've been talking at the 900$ shop. He said he would come by the house (literally around the corner) and take a look. I figured I needed to do the sanding first.

    edit: also, yes. I know the maaco job would come with the primer. I'm not sure about this 900$ job but I bet it will. However; it's prob. something I could do myself and that would be another price drop for me. ;)

    edit again: I was curious. I asked earlier. The panels of the car that have no clearcoat problem. Should I sand those with 600 or start with 320 like the panels with clear coat problems?
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2009
  7. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    This is the trunk. I hit it with a RA with 80 then 120 grit. It appears to not be the original trunk and was red and painted over. Should I continue and sand down to the metal or hit it again with 120 all the way around to the primer?
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    The hood had 320 done and then in this pic it has a quick 20 minute 600 grit wiped across.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    The side panel had no clear coat issues. This is just 320 applied.
    [​IMG]
    Comments always welcomed.
     
  8. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    Guess some before pics would help to give the thread a bit of depth. ;-)

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  9. flynfrog

    flynfrog Cool isnt Cheap

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    you are going to see alot of sanding scratches through your paint. You have shit on your paper.

    You really need a DA with 600 grit

    all of that cracked stuff has to go down till its not there anymore.

    after all this work skip maco and put real paint on the car


    ps sell me your rear window trim
     
  10. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    no loser. u gave up your mark
     
  11. BlazinBlazer Guy

    BlazinBlazer Guy Witness to The De-Evolution of Mankind.

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    :werd: The more I see of this car, the more of a mess it looks to be. Definitely biting off more than you're equipped to chew as a first-time DIYer on a tight budget.
     
  12. justin30513

    justin30513 New Member

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    That is a mess fro a beginner but who know, you might pull it out.

    I do applaud you for trying. You just need to listen and do what others are telling you.
     
  13. seismic

    seismic New Member

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    Speaking from personal experience doing this to my own car: prep work is what makes or breaks a paint job. Prepare to be disappointed with the outcome. No offense intended.

    I sanded over my entire car by hand a good 6 or 7 times while having someone with 30 years of paint work experience supervise, and there are still some spots that didn't come out "perfect" due to my own inexperience.

    Honestly if I were in your position, with my own personal paint job behind me, I would find the money and have a real body shop do the prep work if you care about how the paint job is going to look after. A good paint job takes a lot of practice to achieve.

    Edit: I did it all by hand because he said I would fuck it up if I used power tools... take that as you will. :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2009
  14. Pussysmith

    Pussysmith Banned

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    You can do it yourself. You know a hot water pressure washer will take all the paint off in about 10 minutes...A guy on a Porsche forum posted pictures and it looked good. If you gouge the metal the painter is gonna have to just put on a nice thick primer and then block it smooth. Or if its real deep he will use some mud in the scratches. Either way, its an old lincoln so I assume you just want a presentable paint job and not the sun burned one you got.
     
  15. jjski78

    jjski78 New Member

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    Take the whole car down to bare metal, seriously. You don't have the skill to feather edges to the point where they won't show through. Your best bet is to take some zip strip or rent a sandblaster and just take that whole sucker down to metal.

    For the $900 the "good" painter is going to charge you, you could do the whole damn thing yourself and save some money. I'm saying this because I'd bet you a buck the "good" painter is going to do what Maaco would do, spray paint over whatever the hell you bring in, with no attention to detail. The only difference is a clear coat. That's a recipe for a shitty looking car, and he won't stand behind his work because YOU did the prep.

    Go get yourself a DA, a compressor, and a paint gun and do the whole thing yourself. Also get a metric ass ton of wet sand paper. The car isn't going to be a show car anyways, you might as well do the whole damn thing and make it a total learning experience.

    Get this:
    http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_...Compressors+&+Air+Tools&sName=Air+Compressors

    this:
    http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_...ame=Air+Compressors+&+Air+Tools&sName=Sanders

    this:
    http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_...=Air+Compressors+&+Air+Tools&sName=Spray+Guns

    and this:
    http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_...mpressors+&+Air+Tools&sName=Air+Hoses+&+Reels

    You can get all the tools for under $500. Use the new Dupli-Color paint shop paints that you can get dirt cheap from Autozone or any other parts store. I mean, that's what I would do personally. That way when it looks like crap the only person you have to blame is yourself.
     
  16. jjski78

    jjski78 New Member

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    And I would also recommend painting it either silver or white. It hides imperfections. You're begging for a shitty looking car with dark colors if you're not willing to cough up a few grand to have a good shop do it from prep to finish.
     
  17. shanker

    shanker unemployed

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    silver will not hide imperfections....it will show every little sanding scratch


    White would be his best bet
     
  18. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    Sorry for not updating lately guys. Let me answer a few questions so far.

    1.
    I do have a power washer so taking it down to bare metal is an option. It's not a "Hot Water" pressure washer though.

    2. I have started using a RA sander after talking to some 'professionals'. Not a cheap RA it's variable speed with more torque than the 50$ jobs at home depot. (I bought an DA sander/polisher from a pawn shop but it crapped out) Does the 'forced rotation' of an RA make the swirl marks?

    3. I bought 100 grit for the trunk to go down to bare metal. 220 grit for the first sanding. then 100 pads of 400 grit and 100 pads of 800 grit. the Results are much better but there are still tiny swirl marks left. I assume it's because of the RA sander and not a DA.

    4. I got putty and filler for dents and dings. The putty I'm told is for dings and the filler is your 'bondo' for large dings. (of which I have one)

    5. I don't know 'how' to 'block' something. Well.. I don't know the procedure lets say. I can spackle with the best of them.

    6. I've found out that 2 panels are painted 2 colors. Meaning the panels were originally red and repainted black. I'm assuming to keep the paint thin and not likely to chip I need to sand down to at least the red on those panels.

    7. Since 2 cars are being done (a truck also). I am thinking about painting myself. My neighbor has done it a few times when he raced cars back in his day and like you guys says its all about prep. The problem is my compressor is only 23 gallons and doesn't have the volume needed for a painting gun.

    8. The reason for the late update is I've found rust in a couple spots and have been doing my best to grind it all out.

    I do understand that this is not going to be 'perfect' but like someone else posted. I just want something 'presentable'. Which is what I would get if I took it to a shop.

    I'll get pics soon but would love some comments or suggestions.

    edit: ohh and yes. A shop would not have done any of this prep work I'm doing I'm sure. Not for my price range.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2009
  19. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    My compressor is better than this one. Rated at 5.6cfm at 40psi and 3.8 at 90PSI. The problems is the sprayers ( like the one you posted ) requires more than what I have. "Requires tank-type air compressor delivering a min. of 8.5 SCFM @ 40 psi" I could try to use it and just let the compressor catch up but not sure if it would be a problem spraying the paint.
     
  20. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    Presently the car sits like this. The hood and the roof need slight touch ups in areas I didn't see before washing the car but are otherwise as best I can do with the RA sander 400/800 pads and are the only 'finished' panels.

    I think the middle patch on the trunk is bondo. Took a pic hoping someone could confirm. Also you see the door with the 2 coats of paint red/black.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    roof
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    trunk
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  21. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    My plan as far as primering goes. Is 1 very very light coat and then 3 following coats. Then 400/800 sanding.
     
  22. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    I'm really thinking of the power washing or the air use DA. The DA requires 4cfm and my compressor makes 3.8 at 90psi.
    ". 4 cfm average air consumption. 1/4 in. NPT air inlet. 60 to 90 PSI maximum operating pressure."

    I think it willl work.
     
  23. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    Update again. I now have access to a large compressor and will be using the DA in this thread to go back over some spots.
     
  24. jjski78

    jjski78 New Member

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    Those weird little spots do look like body filler. As far as the panels with red and black, like I said before, to avoid lots of problems with the finish, my suggestion is to take the whole car down to bare metal. Yeah, it's a bitch, but that's what I would do. Then use a high-build primer on it and sand that sucker until it's smooth. If your sander is leaving visible swirls, switch to the DA. 800 grit finish on the primer coat should set you right. If you now have access to a bigger compressor, buy a sprayer and paint that sucker yourself. Hell, you've got a compressor, you got the sanders, all you need is the sprayer. Hell, since all you have to buy is a sprayer you could actually buy good paint and still come out on top money wise. Just my .02 but I would use that car to have some fun. I wish I had a project like that laying around just to kill some time.
     
  25. Mycophiles

    Mycophiles OT Supporter

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    Been eye'ing an old porche myself. But enough of that....
     

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