Discussion in 'OT Driven' started by notaniceperson, Jan 23, 2009.
Noticed they are ready to be replaced today. Open to suggestions.
on my '99 FRC, I have BFG g-force T/A KDWs and I like them... good handling in the wet and dry, not too much road noise (my FRC is in the weeds, so that's a big issue for me) and they've held up pretty well.
Thanks, any ideas on the Toyo Proxes?
What are you looking to do with them? For street use, the KDWs are great, and the Proxes would be ok so long as you weren't looking to push them too hard. If you don't mind spending the money, Michelin Pilot Sport PS2s are fantastic. My dad has them on his Z06. I have Eagle F1 GS tires on my 99FRC (they were on there when I bought it.) They're ok, but they don't have nearly the grip of the PS2s. Another great street tire is the Eagle F1 GS-D3. They have good treadwear, and great dry and wet traction. They overheat easily though (that's a compromise for the wet traction compound) and shouldn't be used on a track at all, even autocross is kinda pushing it with them. If you're looking for maximum dry traction for street and autocross use, look at the Falken Azenis RT-615s. They grip like mad on dry pavement, and they're pretty good with heat management. I still wouldn't want to take them to a track for hard use over an extended period of time, but they're great for everything else as long as it's dry.
99 FRC crew.
Hey thanks for the informed response.
Mostly street use, with MAYBE an auto-X/drag strip run thrown in here and there for fun. I plant o get another set of wheels with race compound when I take it to the track.
If you want the "ultimate" in street traction get the PS2s. If you want 95% the dry performance, and BETTER wet performance get the GS-D3. The GS-D3s will cost less than the PS2s too. The KDW will have less wet and dry traction than either the GS-D3 or the PS2, but they will cost even less. They're all decent street tires.
I've had the old design KDW's on my 99 SS for quite some time now and could be happier. Price is low, decent traction and reasonably quiet (car is loud so maybe hard to tell). Girlfriend has them on her 00 GT also and loves them.
Nitto is coming out with a new Max-performance street tire in February, the NT-05. It's supposed to bridge the gap between an NT555 summer tire and their NT-01 R-comp.
UTQG is 200, Traction AA, Temp A
Should be good for a Vette if they come in your sizes.
Available 1st Quarter 2009
255/40ZR17 98W XL
235/40ZR18 95W XL
245/40ZR18 97W XL
265/35ZR18 97W XL
275/35ZR18 99W XL
285/35ZR18 101W XL
225/40ZR19 93W XL
235/35ZR19 91W XL
245/35ZR19 93W XL
275/30ZR19 96W XL
275/35ZR19 100W XL
275/40ZR20 106W XL
315/35ZR20 110W XL
Available 2nd Quarter 2009
245/40ZR19 98W XL
255/35ZR20 97W XL
275/35ZR20 102W XL
I like that tire a lot, but 200 tread wear rating? The 555 is a better deal if you ask me.
If I were going to get something with such low treadwear, and large treadblocks with little void area, I'd just get RT-615s. The RT-615 is a proven performer, and there's of lots of discussion out there with what works and doesn't work.
The problem with the RT-615 and the new Nitto pictured above is they're both going to have shitty wet traction, which isn't nice on a car that spends the vast majority of its time on the street.
Yeah the stock tires SUCK int he rain so i definitely want something that will hold its own in weather.
I ran Yoko A032R r-compounds on the street in my 94 Camaro for about 5000 kms. They were used when I got them, and had marginal life left. Remember going on a cruise to Niagara falls on a hot day and they were sticky. Launched the M6 car at 3500 RPM and with 310 RW at that time the car launched like a maniac with no wheel spin at all.
I've never used A032R tires, but I've seen them used at autocrosses and track days. They are amazing in the dry, but again, they lack even decent wet weather traction. Anything in the R compound realm is going to have poor wet weather traction unless they're dedicated rain tires. The rubber compounds they use are designed to work at specific temperatures, and dry tires work at much higher temps than wet tires. This doesn't even take into account void space and the ability to move water from under the tire, which is also critical to wet weather performance. If you want good wet weather handling and good dry handling, you aren't going to find anything in the R compound world, or even anything in the near-R compound world (RT-615 or that new Nitto, etc...) You need a tire that's really designed as a street tire. You will have to give up the large tread blocks that you find on racing tires, and you have to give up the ability to deal well with the types of temperatures you'll experience on a track. Really, a street car needs street tires. The tire engineers aren't idiots, they know what they're doing.
I'm not trying to single anyone out for this, and it's fine to run R compounds on the street in the dry, but your treadlife is going to suck, and let's face it, you're not going to be able to push them like you would on a track. You'll never get the temperatures high enough to really take advantage of their available traction, and the constant heat cycling of being used on the street will degrade the rubber compound fast.
^ I'm listening to this dude.
Whats is your input on the Proxes I mentioned earlier? I look at prices and see that I can put them on for half of what some of these other tires are running.
What model of Proxes are you looking at? Toyo Proxes is just a line of tires, there are specific models in that line. It's like Bridgestone's Potenza line, there are different models.
The Proxes that I have experience with are the T1-S. They have been eclipsed by the T1-R as their high performance supper tire. I have heard that the T1-R is better in all areas than the T1-S, but the improvements are incremental. That being said, here is my impression of the T1-S, just assume the T1-R is a little better in each area. I found the T1-S to have decent grip on wet and dry pavement, it can't match the PS2 or GS-D3 in any situation (I doubt the T1-R would either.) The T1-S has good treadlife, I'd say similar to the GS-D3 (both better than the PS2.) They are also relatively light tires, often a pound or two lighter than other tires of similar size. You'll have to check and see if you can find the weights for the T1-R, but if they are light as well it would be nice. By reducing a couple pounds of unsprung rotational mass you might not feel the difference, but it will at least theoretically accelerate and brake slightly faster, also it's kinder to your suspension. That being said, a tire with more absolute grip and slightly more weight will still be faster. My biggest problem with the T1-S (and I've heard similar complaints about the T1-R) is the relatively soft sidewalls. This makes the car's turn in feel kind of lazy, it's like the tires have to "catch up" with your steering inputs. A tire with less sidewall flex will make the steering feel more responsive. The T1-S wasn't a bad tire at all, and seeing as it was priced lower than lots of other options, it was a viable option. I know budget is a concern for most anyone (myself definitely included) so you really have to make an honest appraisal of what you want to do with the car. As far as street tires go, the T1-S and T1-R are perfectly fine, and they manage to be fine at a decent cost. If I were really pushing the car to the limits on a mountain road, I'd wish I had something else though. On the other hand, if the vast majority of your driving is on the streets cruising or just getting from point A to point B, then it's really not necessary to be burning up a $1400 set of PS2s.
Actually, I just remembered, I had a set of Proxes FZ4s on my M3 when I got it. They sucked. Wet and dry traction was crappy and turn in was sloppy. Of course, they are hi-performance all seasons, not summer tires. Really, the only Proxes I'd consider for a street car would be the T1-R.
I'm in full agreement. Thought it was a fun story to share.
I knew I had limited street life and one track day. What a hell of a track day it was though!!!
Thanks, I am going with the T1R, but am also looking at BF goodrich G-Force T/A for a couple dollars more.
Any input on those as well?
Great information and input man, I really appreciate it.
No problem. I'm glad to help. What G-Force T/A tires are you looking at? The KD or the KDWs? The KDs are really only for dry weather, and they'll have similar wet performance to the RT-615 and those Nittos that were posted earlier in the thread. The KDWs are designed to work in the wet, and they're good street tires. They don't handle heat well though (I'm talking like on a track here, they'll be ok at an autocross as long as they're able to cool a bit between runs.) I ran a track day with a guy once who had a brand new set of the new tread design KDWs on a IS300. By the end of the track day, the tires were destroyed. There was massive chinking of the rubber all across the tread surface, and especially on the outer tread blocks on the front tires. When they get too hot they just tear themselves apart.
Do you work at a tire shop?
Yeah, also it doesn't really grip for shit w/ it's 300 treadwear rating. Ask me how I know
No. I run an IT department. I was really into autocross/trackdays a few years ago. I have direct personal experience with a few different tires that have been mentioned here, and I've talked to a lot of people at the track/autocrosses about the tires they're running.