MMA So I am coming from a traditional wrestling/gnp background

Discussion in 'OT Bar' started by G-n-P, Nov 6, 2005.

  1. G-n-P

    G-n-P New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2005
    Messages:
    5,126
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tulsa
    and after the stevenson/cummo and the diaz/sanchez (especially) fights......I really think that the scoring needs to be reworked. I think that Luke may have lost slightly, due to being controlled somewhat on the ground. But honestly can anyone explain why Diaz lost that fight other than a couple elbows that Diego landed in rd 1?

    I am sick of the way these fights are scored. I don't like decisions. If there is going to be a desicion there needs to be a concrete set of scoring rules for the ground game, much like in a sub tourny but modified to reflect the mma environment. Right now too many close fights with no clear winner are being given away to the guy who likes to work from the top or gets a takedown here or there. Is a clean strike that lands and rocks an opponent not as important as taking a guy down and holding him there for half a round?
     
  2. Sammo

    Sammo New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2005
    Messages:
    43,376
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Southern Canada
    interesting...

    I don't know much about scoring in UFC/Pride right now, but yeah it seems that fighters can win a decision by holding from the top quite a bit

    sucks really
     
  3. brolli

    brolli OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2005
    Messages:
    12,802
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    CHERRY HILL, NJ
    Totally have to agree with you. I hate it when a good wrestler with bad everything else takes advantage of the scoring and takes their opponent down and holds them there for 3 rounds. I know in pride they give the decision to who "almost" won, but not sure how it works for the ufc. What exactly does 30-27 mean?
     
  4. Sammo

    Sammo New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2005
    Messages:
    43,376
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Southern Canada
    they score 10 points per round, that means that Diego got 10 points every round and the rounds for Diaz added up to 27 somehow
     
  5. d0nk3ypunch

    d0nk3ypunch New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2002
    Messages:
    6,635
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Austin TX
    I agree 100%

    I think that Diego mainly won because he was on top most of the time. Which as you and I both know means jack shit if you aren't doing any damage. I think Diaz may have inflicted a little more damage overall than Diego.

    What Diez did do was defend extremely well. I was very impressed with his ability to keep/retake guard over and over.
     
  6. Maestro Nobones

    Maestro Nobones Great Job! - GLAD DADS CREW

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2004
    Messages:
    34,659
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    in austin at the studio or the dojo
    yeah that was some fantastic guard retention on diaz's part.

    I couldn't really call that fight myself, I wouldn't wanna be a judge.
     
  7. d0nk3ypunch

    d0nk3ypunch New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2002
    Messages:
    6,635
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Austin TX
    It was super easy to call using the UFC's normal judging criteria. But from a more sane standpoint, it was pretty close.

    Diaz stayed really active from the bottom. His upkicks were great, and he was feeling diego out for subs most of the time.
     
  8. G-n-P

    G-n-P New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2005
    Messages:
    5,126
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Tulsa
    I was really impressed with Diaz's jiu jitsu. Basically he was making Diego look bad from the bottom. His transitions were flawless and he never was stuck IMO. He landed better strikes overall than DIego, but in the UFC a takedown and top position is enough for a unanimous decision i guess. Sad really...Diaz has every right to be bitter about some guy who gets picked up for TUF 1 making 10x (including endorsements) what he is and not having to prove himself like he has.
     
  9. Maestro Nobones

    Maestro Nobones Great Job! - GLAD DADS CREW

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2004
    Messages:
    34,659
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    in austin at the studio or the dojo
    takedown + top position + preferred treatment = unanimous decision
     
  10. brolli

    brolli OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2005
    Messages:
    12,802
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    CHERRY HILL, NJ
    sometimes I still wish that the UFC had no time limit/rounds :p
     
  11. SquirtRussel

    SquirtRussel OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2004
    Messages:
    28,298
    Likes Received:
    74
    Location:
    San Francisco
  12. chechen

    chechen Brazilian Jiu Jitsu OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2003
    Messages:
    23,881
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    despite the fact diaz did an awesome job from the bottom. he never put diego in lot of trouble. diego looked more aggressive, and was constantly taking diaz down, and almost taking his back several times. even if you scored points in a BJJ way, diego would've won.

    and this is coming from a guy who doesnt like him too much
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2005
  13. AznFreeballiN

    AznFreeballiN mangekyo sharingan

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2001
    Messages:
    7,635
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    so.cal
    god i wish diaz knocked diego's ass out.
     
  14. deadbolt

    deadbolt New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2004
    Messages:
    21,374
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Southern California
    diego was EXTREMELY aggresive, i think that helped a ton as well
     
  15. Phazel

    Phazel Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2004
    Messages:
    32,492
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    yeah
    But the fight would have been closer. Diaz reversed to many moves that were attempted on him. The score made it look like he got dominated, when in reality it should have been a close fight.
     
  16. Rommel

    Rommel friends forever

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2001
    Messages:
    36,867
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    /yourself now
    a unaminous decision just means that everyone agrees that he won the fight

    30-26 would have been a domination score, 30-27 just means that everyone agrees that he won every round which imo he did
     
  17. Placebo

    Placebo New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    4,166
    Likes Received:
    0
    ...so does pretty much everyone except Rommel. He is on Diego's nuts to no end for some reason.
     
  18. Rommel

    Rommel friends forever

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2001
    Messages:
    36,867
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    /yourself now
    because i know how good he is, people hate him because he's arrogant, because he's a bit wierd. But i respect the fact that the guy just lives for fighting, he works real hard, is always exciting and pushes the pace non stop. What's not to like.

    i picked diego to walk through diaz and i was right.
     
  19. Placebo

    Placebo New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    4,166
    Likes Received:
    0
    Can you tell me which professional fighter doesn't live for fighting or work hard? They wouldn't be professional if that wasn't the case.

    If by walked through you mean took down and kept down while doing little to no damage you would be right. Maybe in your world when someone stays in the opponent's guard and repeatedly throws random punches at the floor next to their opponent's head that is walking through them.

    The problem came whenever they were standing up which is where diego was made his bitch. Too bad diez has very subpar takedown defence otherwise that fight would have had a totally different ending.
     
  20. Rommel

    Rommel friends forever

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2001
    Messages:
    36,867
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    /yourself now
    What i mean is that diego treats fighting more primitively, more spiritually shall we say. Some fighters consider themselves sportsmen, gladiators, brawlers etc, diego probably thinks that his destiny is to fight and that it's the only thing to live for.

    Diego landed quite a few punches and elbows while diaz threw his legs up in the air in the vague hope of diego falling into a triangle or armbar. He didn't come close to either. Not only that but he took diaz's back at least 4 times, he had mount at one point and he came far closer than diaz to landing that armbar. Diego did a great job of stacking and smacking diaz. Those black eyes which diaz had at the end weren't makeup that's for sure.

    Standing up i saw no punking of Diego, how exactly was diego made diaz's bitch on the feet. Surely if that was the case he would have landed more than a jab. In fact diego landed a nice right hook and 2 knees. Diaz did zero damage on the feet. The closest he came was a left in the third round that didn't even faze diego.

    It's too bad diego doesn't have better boxing otherwise he would have knocked diaz silly on the feet aswell as on the ground.

    I have the video of the fight hosted on a thread here, take a look.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2005
  21. Placebo

    Placebo New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    4,166
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'll definately check it out again, thanks for posting it.
     
  22. FloppyCock

    FloppyCock New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2001
    Messages:
    5,630
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    California
    Listen, as much as you think Diego was just sitting there and not doing any damage, Diaz was doing less. Not only was he on the bottom, getting hit, but he never was close to getting a sub. He was repeatedly taken down, stacked, and hit.

    I don't like Diego, at all. But he won that fight, clear cut.

    If my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle.
     
  23. Acesn8s

    Acesn8s The Deadman's Hand

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2002
    Messages:
    6,209
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Allentown PA
    UFC needs to extend the time limit of their rounds. With that many matches going to decision the've got great match-ups, now they just need to give the fighters a little more time to win the fight.
     
  24. JordanClarkson

    JordanClarkson OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2002
    Messages:
    59,954
    Likes Received:
    16
    Location:
    Go Dodger Blue!
    Sort of a catch 22 though because the fighters might stall more. The Saku/Gracie fight had no time limit but was rather boring to watch.
     
  25. d0nk3ypunch

    d0nk3ypunch New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2002
    Messages:
    6,635
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Austin TX

    I personally thought it was a great fight.

    I agree time limits are important, although I sorta prefer the 10-5-5 setup pride uses.
     

Share This Page