MMA Rankings and Nick Diaz

Discussion in 'OT Bar' started by Beepsandbuzzes, Jun 6, 2008.

  1. Beepsandbuzzes

    Beepsandbuzzes New Member

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    So I am pretty clued in on Weight divisions from Middle Weight - Heavyweight. When it gets under Middleweight, while I am familiar with many fighters, I often am not sure what weight division they are in.

    Here are the latest rankings by weight division from Sherdog:
    http://www.sherdog.com/news/rankings.asp?n_id=12928

    Nick Diaz doesn't appear in the top 10 on any of them, to be honest I am not sure what weight division he is considered a part of, but I am of the opinion he is a top ten fighter in whatever weight division he is fighting in (Maybe not top 5, but top 10). I guess he isn't included anywhere since his fight vs Gomi was overturned because of his positive testing for Weed. Thoughts and opinions on this? Do other people think he's top ten? Also, what weight division is he considered a part of?
     
  2. Beepsandbuzzes

    Beepsandbuzzes New Member

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    Another point I'd like to make is that I don't think rankings should be based solely on the outcome of fights (i.e. who the winner is), which I think they usually are. I think that when fighters show enormous amounts of skill, and fight close fights, even if they lose, this should add credence to their being a higher ranked fighter. Unfortunately this is much more subjective to evaluate than merely who wins the fight, so it is difficult to incorporate it into rankings.
     
  3. XJ3B

    XJ3B wat

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    yoji av?
     
  4. The Ripper

    The Ripper New Member

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    well I think one of the reasons is because he is very inconsistent. In welter weight it is just a stacked division and if you compare the other records of people who fought in that division and who they have beat and there records you can see why he isnt a top 10 fighter in ww

    1. Georges St. Pierre (Pictures) (16-2-0)
    With the Matt Serra (Pictures) drama behind him, St. Pierre's attention now turns to reigning in the fashion expected from him when he first captured the UFC title in November 2006. First on deck for GSP is a fantastic title scrap with Jon Fitch (Pictures), headlining the UFC's August 9 foray in Minnesota.

    2. Jon Fitch (Pictures) (16-2-0, 1 NC)
    Fitch picked up a high-quality win in March, taking out an underrated and largely unknown Chris Wilson. The problem was that he looked less than stellar in doing so, which has quieted much of the hype he brought into the bout. Nonetheless, with St. Pierre regaining the undisputed UFC title, Fitch will likely get his championship chance later this year.

    3. Matt Hughes (Pictures) (41-6-0)
    Although the longtime welterweight king has only a few fights left, Hughes has stepped in to save the injury-plagued UFC 85 card on June 7, where he'll take one of the 170-pound class' new breed in Thiago Alves (Pictures).

    4. Josh Koscheck (Pictures) (10-2-0)
    With a new contract in tow, Koscheck will climb back into the Octagon in July. This time around, he will meet the ever-game Chris Lytle (Pictures) on the Jackson-Griffin undercard.

    5. Diego Sanchez (Pictures) (18-2-0)
    After his destruction of Sweden's David Bielkheden (Pictures) in March, Sanchez is set to get back into the saddle next month. Sanchez will take on tough slugger Luigi Fioravanti (Pictures) on the June 21 finale of TUF 7.

    6. Jake Shields (Pictures) (20-4-1)
    A back injury to Shields initially postponed his Elite XC title defense against Drew Fickett (Pictures) on March 29. Then set for June 14, a knee injury to Fickett has further postponed the bout.

    7. Matt Serra (Pictures) (9-5)
    The slipper dropped for Serra, who was destroyed in his rematch with St. Pierre. However, Serra might not be done in big bouts. A potential clash with Matt Hughes (Pictures) seems likely in the near future.

    8. Thiago Alves (Pictures) (14-3-0)
    After firmly placing himself in the title hunt with his April 2 stoppage of Karo Parisyan (Pictures), Alves is looking for further validation. "Pitbull" has the chance to firmly entrench himself as the next man in line for a crack at GSP's title after Fitch if he can knockoff the sport's most storied welterweight in Matt Hughes (Pictures) in on June 7 in London.

    9. Karo Parisyan (Pictures) (18-5-0)
    Parisyan, who was set to challenge for the UFC welterweight title in November 2005, just had his title hopes take another hit when he was stopped by Thiago Alves (Pictures) in their April 2 bout.

    10. Carlos Condit (Pictures) (22-4-0)
    Condit was the marquee man for the WEC's recent foray into New Mexico and the 170-pound champ didn't disappoint. He avenged his September 2004 loss to Carlo Prater (Pictures) with a first-round guillotine in front of his raucous home crowd.

    All of these guys have great records with the exception of serra and have all beat big name top 10 fighters.

    Carlos Condit - on the lowest part of the list but he beat frank trig and has a great record very consistent and has only lost to people in the top 10

    Karo - good record and he has only lost to people who were higher up on him on the list and of course sean sherk when he was younger

    Thiago - beat alot of ranked guys and has a good record and great name very consistent has only lost to top 10 guys

    Serra - beat GSP and he has only really lost to bigger named guys like bj penn din thomas shonie carter karo and gsp. I mean its understandable if he lost to those guys.

    jake sheilds - great record

    diego sanches - beat nick diaz and has only lost to kos and fitch

    kos - dominant guy and has only lost to gsp recently his other loss he was relatively new

    matt hughes - do I need to say more?

    fitch - two losses and they were in the begining of his career

    GSP - two losses and ones to hughes so thats acceptable and the matt serra thing hey anything can happen but has a pretty consistent track record and is very dominant

    Now lets look at diaz in ww

    He has managed to beat all the sub par to decent guys but when he comes up to fight game competitors always falls short he is right under the line of greatness for ww. Loses to karo, diego, rigs and sherk. So its been proven he can stand with top 10 ww but anything under that he can pretty much take out. I can only see him winning against condit.

    He is by no means a top 10 ww. he was always small for that division and I think thats what it always came down to for him and why he couldnt pass the bar. He is much better suited for lw. Now lets see where he stands at lw

    bj pen - im sorry diaz cant beat penn

    gomi - Diaz has beaten gomi and proven himself worthy of a top 10 spot because he has beat one of the most dominant lws there is.

    aoki - i say 50 / 50 shit there

    JZ - again thats a 50/50 shot

    gilbert melendez - cant tell

    kawajiri he can beat

    he can beat uno

    can beat ishida

    and vs joe stevenson Im not sure.

    So he should be ranked as a top 10 lw to be honest with you. He has the skill to be a top 10 lw, so why the hell hasnt he become one? The answer is he hasnt really done anything in the lw division.

    He beat gomi which was the hl of his career and he should have been ranked then and there but he fucked it up by smoking pot and they called it a no contest. At this point every one is paying atention to diaz he then wins over aina I think it was but he wasnt a top 10 or any one that could boost him up. He then goes to fight KJ Noons and after that fight I think he would have earned himself a top 10 fight by claiming the elite xc title but then fucks it up by coming out sloppy as hell and losing to noons in a fight he should have clearly won.

    He was inconsistent with that and ends up owning himself. Quite frankly the reason why nick diaz isnt a top 10 lw is because he ends up beating himself out of the spot. To be ranked in these divisions you have to prove yourself through wins and accomplishments and he just falls short at ww because the division is so stacked and in lw he just hasnt done anything to warrant it yet.

    I do how ever beleive he will climb up to be a top 10 lw
     
  5. The Ripper

    The Ripper New Member

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    clif notes he cant beat any one worth a damn in welter weight and he hasnt done shit in lw
     
  6. Kenny Dalglish

    Kenny Dalglish New Member

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    gomi?
    and imo i think he beat karo
     
  7. Sylva

    Sylva New Member

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    Who's Karo? What has he done?

    And after he beat gomi he barely beat Mike Anani or whatever his name is and then got an ass beating clinic put on him by KJ Noons.
     
  8. Kenny Dalglish

    Kenny Dalglish New Member

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    karo = welterweight "worth a damn"

    and beating gomi = "doing shit in lw division".. regardless of what he did after or before
     
  9. roose

    roose Guest

    Diaz was diagnosed with a staph infection right after the Anani fight.

    KJ was beating him, but Diaz (and his bro) are like the Stockton Nogs.
     
  10. Sylva

    Sylva New Member

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    1 Fight /= worth a damn.
     
  11. checkii

    checkii ฝรั่งตาน้ำข้าว

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    Didn't heat beat gomi over a year ago?

    god no he shouldnt be ranked, way too many good lightweights that are fighting and winning.
     
  12. The Ripper

    The Ripper New Member

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    exactly why are they going to rank him when there are so many light weights that are as talented or more talented then him and have worked hard and accomplished far more. Rankings are based off of accomplishments and talents its not a fucking popularity contest. Nick diaz may have the talent to be a top 10 lw but he hasnt done shit to prove it so IMO and apparently the opinion of people who make the rankings he doesnt deserve a spot.

    Again do I think he can be ranked a top 10, yes. He just needs to beat some one in lw worth a damn and not have the decision reversed or fucked up.

    exactly he is very inconsistent.

    yeah karo is a ww worth a damn and he lost to it. The gomi decision is a nc because he got stoned some time before the fight soon enough that it would come out on the testing. thats his bad. So its like he never even fought gomi. Thats like saying I beat GSP in a smoker and now I should be concidered a top 10 ww.

    Anani fight Im not gonna complain because he won and thats all that matters staph or not. KJ fight he should have won but came in there slopy as fuck with lazy ass take down attempts.

    exactly you cant bank a career off of one fight.
     
  13. Sammo

    Sammo New Member

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    :hsugh:
     
  14. acidix

    acidix Ua mau, ke ea o ka `aina, i ka pono

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    He fights half his fights at 160, which isn't a weight class. if you consider him a LW, then he's only beat Gomi, which legally you can't consider due to it being overturned. Even at 160, he beat Anani unconvincingly, regardless of staph, and lost to KJ. In the last year... he hasn't bounced back from his pot suspension... period... unless he can get a win streak going against decent opposition, he doesn't deserve a ranking.
     
  15. Sylva

    Sylva New Member

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    Please, list me off Karo's great accomplishments in the MMA world.

    Thats going to a short/non existent list.
     
  16. 2ofdem

    2ofdem OT Supporter

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    Karos a gatekeeper if someones got potential they fight karo if they are any good they win.

    For Nick Diaz rankings check here www.hightimes.com
     
  17. The Ripper

    The Ripper New Member

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    exactly
     
  18. sirthumpsalot

    sirthumpsalot Down for the count

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    nick diaz = crap silly 02s
     
  19. Matt Hood

    Matt Hood New Member

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    damn, kflo is on there. i dunno if nick diaz needs to be on there tho.
     
  20. Kenny Dalglish

    Kenny Dalglish New Member

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    honestly.. you really respect that no contest???
     
  21. Kenny Dalglish

    Kenny Dalglish New Member

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    did you read the post i was replying to?? he said he hasnt beaten anyONE worth a damn at ww.. and i said imo i think he beat karo
     
  22. Sammo

    Sammo New Member

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    lawls are you fucking serious?

    He's beaten:

    Nick Diaz
    Matt Serra
    Chris Lytle
    Ryo Chonnan
    Josh Burkman (who I dislike immensely, but he is an okay gatekeeper in terms of skill)
     
  23. Sylva

    Sylva New Member

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    Save for Matt Serra's fluke KO of GSP. None of them have done ANYTHING. I don't even think any of them are in anyones top ten. Serra might still be lingering around due to time. But in a few months he'll be out for sure.
     
  24. Kuet

    Kuet New Member

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    oh god. not another rankings thread. Not flaming you threadstarter, but like you said they are all too subjective and there really shouldnt be any rankings in mma.
    Champions are champions in their respected weight classes/orgs.
     
  25. Beepsandbuzzes

    Beepsandbuzzes New Member

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    Great post, thanks.
     

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