questions regarding braking in a corner

Discussion in 'OT Driven' started by scent of a wookie, Jun 22, 2009.

  1. scent of a wookie

    scent of a wookie OT Supporter

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    So today was my final day of the MSF course and I passed. :bigthumb:

    Of course, they really stress that braking is much safer and more effective while your bike is straight up (not leaning) but what is the proper technique if you need to slow down in a turn (not emergency stop, just slow down)?

    example: you are following a car at a safe distance around a corner going 30 mph, suddenly they slow down and you must do the same to maintain a safe distance, what do you do?

    Thanks!
     
  2. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    slow and steady....it gets bad when you brake suddenly or harshly, but if you brake slowly then you just slow down.
     
  3. scent of a wookie

    scent of a wookie OT Supporter

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    I was more asking, what combination of front and/or rear brakes?
     
  4. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    and i was more answering.................both, slow and steady pressure. the biggest tip is not to hit either suddenly and get a tire loose.
     
  5. mtnbikekid08

    mtnbikekid08 Aime-moi moins, mais aime-moi longtemps

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    And if you are going to get a tire loose, let it be the rear, because you're fucked if the front locks in a lean.
     
  6. apman0000

    apman0000 OT Supporter

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    what the hell is a front break. well ok that's an exageration but the back break gets more pressure from this guy than the front, as mentioned above you can recover if you lock up a rear but a front pretty much = ouch
     
  7. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    because....................................... you have an aversion to stopping as quickly as you can?

    or are you just talking about when cornering?
     
  8. AVengeance

    AVengeance Active Member

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    Both brakes, biased to rear, while increasing the radius of the turn if possible. Engine braking (which is also rear-wheel braking) is probably a little safer than actual braking, as long as you don't let out the clutch too quickly.
    If the turn is already an increasing radius turn, and you're not out of control, you're already going slow enough to brake some. If it's a decreasing radius turn, you should have already been engine braking (or at least not accellerating) and you have less physics room to play.

    I was surprised to not see anything about increasing/decreasing radius turns in the state motorcycle book. In my experience racing, you have to deal with the two types VERY differently, on four wheels at least. I'm sure the same basic principles apply on two wheels. If you start a curve on the inside, you can safely move toward the outside of the turn as you go through it, effectively making it an increasing radius turn.
     
  9. scent of a wookie

    scent of a wookie OT Supporter

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    what are you talking about?
     
  10. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    I don't know what book you used, but of 6 hrs of classroom time I'd say we spent 5 hours on turns, cornering, and scanning ahead.

    It was MOSTLY about turns when I took MSF.

    He's trying to be all e-hard. Ignore him.
     
  11. mtnbikekid08

    mtnbikekid08 Aime-moi moins, mais aime-moi longtemps

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    Engine braking does not contribute to the braking process. An engine is for accelerating, the brakes are for stopping. Engine braking is simply a byproduct created by engine compression.
    Use the brakes for braking, and the engine for accelerating. In fact, under hard braking you should have the clutch disengaged and you should be using the brakes to stop. The engine, while it seems it is slowing you down, will actually attempt to pull the bike forward.
    You say that you should not let the clutch out too quickly, however the clutch should be engaged fully either way, so what are you trying to say by that?
     
  12. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    :rofl:

    so I accelerated when I meant to go to 5th but kicked it the wrong way and went to 3rd? I didn't know acceleration involved mashing my balls on the gas tank.
     
  13. scent of a wookie

    scent of a wookie OT Supporter

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    engine braking can definitely slow you down, maybe he meant "shouldn't contribute to the braking process"
     
  14. AVengeance

    AVengeance Active Member

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    Yes, it absolutely does, unless your motorcycle freewheels like a bicycle... or a Hupmobile.
    I'll admit I'm new to riding a motorcycle on the street, but I am NOT new to driving, or racing. Used properly, engine braking is part of braking.

    That really depends on what gear you're in for your current speed.
    Because it's easy to downshift, let off the clutch too fast, and lose traction. My Neon (with 13:1 compression) would sometimes get squirrely if I was still too fast for the gear I was shifting into as I entered a turn. My comment was more of "be mindful of the gear you're going into and your current speed" not "take 5 seconds to release the clutch when you downshift in a turn".
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2009
  15. AVengeance

    AVengeance Active Member

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    Guess I should take the class :hs:

    I just mean the state issued book you use to study for the permit and road exam. There was no mention of decreasing / increasing radius turns. There was plenty about scanning ahead, brake before the turn (good advice on 4 wheels, too), etc.
     
  16. mtnbikekid08

    mtnbikekid08 Aime-moi moins, mais aime-moi longtemps

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    That is simply a combination of the gear ratio, engine RPM, and compression resistance that is slowing you down. It does indeed slow you down, as can be proven when you let off the gas, however when slowing down very rapidly, you should pull the clutch in as the engine is still attempting to pull you forward(though this is not very noticeable).
     
  17. Vermincelli

    Vermincelli Banned

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    GET OFF MY LAWN!
    engine braking is a big part of every vehicle's braking system and if you ever drive on hilly or mountainous roads, you damn well better know how to engine brake because it's what's going to slow you down 90% of time and save your ass from brake failure due to overheating.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2009
  18. apman0000

    apman0000 OT Supporter

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    maybe it's just me after reading some of the responses (not necassarily yours, someone else asked what i was talking about but i would think most would agree that a bunch of front break in a corner would be a bad thing), i don't like using too much front break in a corner. if ya have to stop quick there may be no choice but the more work i can have my back break do the better, heavy front break in a corner is a pretty good way to meet the pavement imo
     
  19. BlkDrgnZ28

    BlkDrgnZ28 OT Supporter

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    if it comes to the point of emergency brake though you should try to straighten out brake hard if you don't have to go over a curve or steep ditch it kinda how i remember it out of the florida motorcycle handbook
     
  20. scent of a wookie

    scent of a wookie OT Supporter

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    we covered that in the MSF, but they never went over standard braking in corners at all, just chose to ignore in the sense that ideally we would always brake straight up

    which I think is unrealistic
     
  21. Elfling

    Elfling New Member

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    Ideally you shouldn't be braking in a turn at all. :dunno: That's why setup for the turn is so important. You should focus on swerving if there's an obstacle or throttling out if you feel like you're going to tip. If you *have* to brake suddenly, that's when you need to straighten out your line and brake with both brakes.

    Not being all e-hard, I'm still a noob rider myself :o
     
  22. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    that may have been your instructor's choice then, because we covered it and I think I remember seeing it on the list of exercises.
     
  23. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    well, I thought we were talking about what to do if you have to brake in a corner, so answering "you shouldn't have to brake in a corner" isn't exactly helpful....sometimes you will have to and it's better to be ready.

    I live in new england and don't get to ride for about 4 months/yr. every spring I take my bike to an empty parking lot and get reacquainted with hard braking, hard cornering, quick turns, etc. I actually practice slow and steady pressure during a turn for when it happens in the real world.
     
  24. Junkie

    Junkie re-tarded OT Supporter

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    I often intentionally brake into corners, along with a downshift or two to get the ass end out.
     
  25. Elfling

    Elfling New Member

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    Not talking about braking before the corner, just in it with the handlebars turned. Unless you're talking about trail braking with the rear brake? I think the OP is talking about full braking.
     

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