question for the techy savay (drivetrain chatter)

Discussion in 'OT Driven' started by Fareo, Sep 17, 2007.

  1. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    ok so im trying to understand something,

    i used to have a '97 dodge dakota single cab 5.2V8 5 speed (2-3 bel-tech drop).. i sold it.. and i just got a '04 dodge dakota single cab 4.7V8 5 Speed (stock sus).

    what im trying to figure out is why my new truck feels like im driving a seesaw and my old truck felt like a dropped mustang?? for starters the throttle spring is super soft (this i know how to fix) but what i dont understand is when im decellerating and it gets to about 1k rpm you know how you get that disconnection feeling?

    typically its really sublte, you just get alil chug and then it stabizes(or thats atleast how it was in my 97). with this truck it when it hits the chug it chatters alil bit and if im floating over throttle the chugs make me tap it and it looks like im learning how to drive stick.. :o... i used to work as a lot porter for dodge and this is how the 4 banger 5 speed dakotas drove?

    so what casues this? is it soft clutch springs? could it be becasue its not dropped? i no leafs bend up like an S when you nail the throttle, which is why we have traction bars so id amagin that the leafs moving that much moves the whole drivetrain around alot? so would it be that my leafs are too soft? or soft drivetrain bushings mounts? or is it the stupid throttle spring?? what could be so different from my 97 to 04?

    as far as i understand it, they are pretty much the same truck, that Gen dakota spans from 97-04 the tranny is the same NV3500 in both trucks, they both have and had a 3.55 anti-spin diff? the only major differance (that i can think of) is the engine?

    your thoughts? :dunno:





    pix for thoughs who dont want to read :o

    old truck
    [​IMG]

    new truck
    [​IMG]

    new goal (- the air ride sus, im gonna do a 3-4 or 2-4 prolly).. just a basic idea.
    [​IMG]

    *edit* i know its a truck, but to most "truck guys" say that becasue its a lowered and performance like that its "not a truck anymore" so i donno it belongs in the American Muscle Truck forum but it doesnt exsist and i post here more - :o
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2007
  2. matrix243

    matrix243 Earn this. Earn it.

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    pinion angle.
     
  3. Trevor_Shiggs

    Trevor_Shiggs T-Swift :love:

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    its a dodge. keke
     
  4. Kenny Powers

    Kenny Powers OT Supporter

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    TRUMP IS MY PRESIDENT
    I have no useful information, but your current truck looks so much better than the two that are slammed.
     
  5. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    :ugh: really? ... i think it looks redneck, with its huge 65 series tires (on a 2WD single cab) and chrome grill shell .. the tires make it look really stubby like a tonka truck:o

    first step is a red grill shell, smaller tires, and a 2-4 drop :x:


    back to topic, i think im gonna have a Dodge tech look at it as see if theres something wrong, casue i had a service adviser that i know look at it and he agreed that the throttle is too soft and theres alot of slack in the cable, also the sus seems kinda soft like the shocks have gone bad which is strange for a truck with 16k miles...

    :confused: .. lucky for me it still falls under the factory powertrain warrenty :wiggle:
     
  6. High Voltage

    High Voltage Guest

    trucks are meant to go up not down. you need to rethink your plans
     
  7. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    Are you nuts? It doesn't look redneck. (You should come visit VA, or even better WVA.) It doesn't have body rust, or a gun rack, or a Rustoleum paint job, or anything like that. It's a well-kept small pickup truck. The slammed trucks, on the other hand, look dumb as hell; they can't hold as many people as a sedan, they can't carry any cargo because they're so low to the ground, the ride is probably like they've got no springs in the back, and they get crappy gas mileage because what shred of aerodynamics they have has been totally altered now.

    And I'm not a truck guy.

    But whatever, if you're going to keep it, my guess is the "chugging" is coming from bad ignition timing and/or buildup in the cylinders. It could be your plugs are dirty because that truck probably hasn't really worked a day in its life (which is good for buying used, but not for keeping the plugs clean), or maybe your timing is off by a tooth, or maybe your plug wires are corroded, or maybe all of the above.

    I've had really good luck with using Seafoam (Autozone, red/white metal can) for combustion chamber cleaning. Suck about half a cup of the stuff into the engine through a disconnected vacuum hose, shut the engine off for about ten minutes, then start it back up and go drive it like you stole it until the smoke burns off. I've never had a car that didn't run better after that.
     
  8. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    how am i nuts? ... i live in california in the city, not the country, a lowered truck would mean a better center of gravity and better handling, it would feel smaller thus making it easier to park and move in and out of traffic, improved stability at high speeds when windy, better traction for take offs. honestly there is no reason why you shouldnt lower a 2WD truck, becasue it just over all improves the vehicle..

    all trucks get bad MPG and if i wanted to hold 4 people i wouldnt have bought a single cab genius. :slap: i have me and a girlfriend, and all my friends can drive, why would i need a sedan?

    cutting the spings so that the frame sits about an a half an inch off the ground and rides like shit is another thing, but im talking about a real Bel-Tech lowering kit and polyurethane bushings that only lowers the truck about 2 inchs in the front and 3 or 4 in the back. which is just slightly lower then a stock R/T dakota.

    ive had a lowered truck and ive helped a buddy move, ive hauled transmissions, engines, taken abunch of shit to the dump, picked up funiture, just fine with a 2-3 drop. now i might not beable to haul 27 bails of hay, but then agian if i was gonna haul 27 bails of hay why would i buy a single dakota 2wd? id be a redneck and get a F250 superduty crew cab.

    well then that makes sense why you think lowered trucks are stupid, now doesnt it? i think tampons are stupid, but then agian i dont bleed from my vagina, do i? :o

    no im gonna sell it now becasue you dont aprove :o

    buildup in the cylinders, dirty plugs? corroded plug wires? .. :ugh: .. its a '04 with 16k miles.... jesus, whats it gonna look like a 100k miles :noes:

    :o

    ya sure if this was a 1989 honda accord with 198,000 miles that i didnt care about id dump some seafoam in there but im not about to dump that shit into a brand new engine.:ugh2: .. oh and thanks for the description and where to get it, i had no idea what seafoam was or where i might find some kinda of automotive engine treatment, saves me a trip Linens and Things :mamoru:

    you must be somewhat retarded, in that case im sorry for ripping on you, you just cant help it. :o
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2007
  9. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    :ugh2: Riiiiight.. a lifted truck in the city thats never gonna see the dirt is about a cool as slamming your penis in a bank vault...
     
  10. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    back to topic, so ive asked around, had a dodge tech that i know drive it and ive come to this.

    tech said that on the 4.7 it shuts the fuel off completly when you get off the throttle unlike the 5.2 so that might have something to do with it and there might be a flash update to help the problem,

    friend of mine suggested that i twist my driveshaft with my hand and see if i have any slop in my driveline or check to see if theres an ajustment on my pinion gear to tighten up the line. which i have yet to do casue i just got off work and i kinda just wanna spend some quality time with my PS3 and wind down :hs:.

    i still think my soft stock suspention might have alil bit to do with it but i donno.. i think im gonna send it in and have a dodge tech put it on a rack.

    :dunno: anyone else with alil more knowage of this then "you shouldnt lower you truck" have any ideas?
     
  11. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    At least I tried to help, jackass. I'd take you on a guided tour of everyone else's posts, but it's a pretty short thread thus far.

    As for whether a lowered truck makes sense -- only in California would someone buy a truck to be cool and then lower it to be practical, instead of just buying a goddamned sedan in the first place. Reminds me of a friend I had in college who thought it was the strangest thing that I would actually buy ankle socks instead of buying crew socks and rolling them down to my ankles.

    Yet more proof that there's a Right coast, and there's a Wrong coast.
     
  12. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    you try to help in every post on here, but the problem is you dont think before you type. did it ever occur to you that it being a '04 it could have low miles thus making engine build up not the problem? stop trying to be a know it all. if you really wanna help ask me some more questions like.. i donno? how many miles it has? before claiming its due to lack of maintenance

    i didnt buy a truck to be cool, asshat. i bought a truck becasue i typically find a use for having a bed, but i dont need a heavy duty 8ft bed for hauling 4 million tons of gravel. i need to carry my guitars and amps or other large random objects.

    i just had a '02 dakota club cab 4x4 but i sold it becasue it was a waste of money. i never took it offroad, i never used the x-cab, all i did was drive to work an back and move my guitars around. so i bought a smaller, cheaper truck.

    but honestly id rather have a '04-'06 GTO, problem is i cant get a GTO with a truck bed (yet :x:). as soon as the UTE crosses the ocean to the american market ill be right there to trade this in, but untill then the closest thing i can get to a UTE is a dakota with a V8 5speed.

    what the fuck is with you and your boner for sedans... thats the kinda of statment i get from my "non-car guy" buddys.

    they say "hey im gonna get a camry"
    and i say "why?"
    they say "cause it seats 4 and it gets good MPG"
    i say " but its just you and you have no girlfriend or kids"
    they say ... .... .. "so"... :dunno:

    anyone that should be on these boards should be somewhat into cars and not consider buying "sheep cars". by sheep cars i mean what the mass majority buys for there wife and 2 kids family that only knows that a car has 4 tires and an engine. and basicly buys a car from what consumer reports or the salesmen has to say.

    right becasue there is aboslutly nobody on the east coast that has a lowered truck.. :squint:

    :slap: .... :gtfo:
     
  13. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    by the way, you didnt try to help me.

    1.you dissed on my truck
    2.asumed what was wrong with no info
    3.asumed that i might not keep it now becasue you told me it was dumb
    4.then insulted my automotive intelligence by telling me what seafoam was and where it get it and how to use it, asuming that ive never seen it or anything like it before.
     
  14. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    1. Yes, I did. If you can't handle an opinion, that's your problem. (Oddly, other people dissed too, and you didn't cry about it.)

    2. I suggested a couple of possible causes. It's your fault that you didn't include information you thought was relevant in your first post.

    3. I never assumed you were going to keep it or get rid of it. I said "if you keep it", not "since you're going to keep it".

    4. HTF should I know whether you know what Seafoam is? I know people who've built their own engines who've never seen it because they've never "stooped" to buying stuff at AutoZone.

    5. I like sedans because they're built for the street. Properly tuned, they can corner as well as any coupe or hatchback, and the space behind the front seats 1) exists, and 2) is usable.

    6. If you wanted a lowered truck with cargo space, you should have gotten a Magnum. It has this thing called a roof, and it's really good for keeping your equipment clean and dry.
     
  15. IslanderOffRoad

    IslanderOffRoad Do you even lift kit? OT Supporter

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    will you fucking kill yourself already? You make Light Speed look like a MENSA member.
     
  16. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    no you didnt, and it wasnt an opinion you said they are dumb NOT "i think" they are dumb. yes other people dissed it, but they were 1 word posts. which, if you know anything about OT, you just scroll past. you posted a paragraph and repetedly said it was dumb.

    its not my fault you asumed it had more miles on it then it should. its a 2004, i said that. the average person drives 12k a year thats 36k miles at most. so my plug wires are gonna corrod and im gonna have build up in the cylnders after 36k? give me a break, you were at fault here you should have asked or suggested something based on the info that i gave you, NOT the info that you asumed.

    you shouldnt have said either, you have no right to insult me and asume that i might possibly sell my truck becasue people think "lowered trucks" are stupid.

    ok fine, i will give you this, but you still should have asked me like "have you tryed seafoam yet?" instead of being mister know it all.

    :ugh2: sedans are built for people with familys, thats why they are nic named "family cars". they are not properly tuned.. there not tuned at all, they are degined to run quiet and get good mpg, they cant coner worth a damn the suspention is designed to absorb bumps not hug corners and there is space behind the front seat for lil timmy and tommy. you dont need a seat for you duffle bag, it would fit just as good in the back of a hatch back coupe.

    sure there acceptions to the rule like the WRX but 9 out of 10 sedans are what i just described. sedans are a waste for a 1 person family, a smaller car will wieght less thus giving it better MPG, thus saving you money. instead of having 4 seats just incase you might make some freinds or possibily get a girlfriend with 2 kids.

    Guy 1 :"you dont have a gf or any kids and you barely have friends, why did you get a Maxima?"
    Guy 2 :"well, you never know when you might end up dating a chick with 2 kids or something, gotta be prepared for these kinda things, you know"
    Guy 1: ":slap:"

    A) show me a Magnum with a V8 for $12k and then we'll talk

    B) agian, i dont need 5 seats. 60% of the time its just me in the car and the other % its me and my gf. waste of space and money.

    C)
    [​IMG]

    weird?.. its almost like a trunk, only not... :gtfo3:

    D) if i wanted a lowered truck with cargo space i should have gotten... a lowered truck with cargo space dumbass... :ugh: ...also im pretty sure every truck has cargo space seeing as tho thats kinda the whole point of a truck. weather or not its covered with a piece of metal or fiberglass is one thing but its not like they havent thought of this yet. (ieTonneau Covers)
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2007
  17. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    You're right about most sedans not being tuned for performance. The rest of that post is just you being pussyhurt because nobody liked your slammed ride. Sorry about that.

    Next time, include pertinent info when asking a technical question.
     
  18. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    the point of this thread is not "should i lower my truck or not", im used to the redneck hate on my trucks. its not a big deal for me, the problem here is you. the whole rest of that post was me showing you how much of a tard you are.

    you didnt say anything to the fact that my truck cost about $10k less then a magnum and a bed cover would do the same a roof? or how i said its your fault casue you asumed? you didnt even comment on anything i said, why? becasue you know im right and you have nothing to say.

    no further questions

    /case closed

    :gtfo2: of my thread and let the people who have something useful to say help me out.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2007
  19. 00600

    00600 New Member

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    changing the pinion angle won't do anything to tighten up the backlash. Well, it will if you go too far, but by the time you get to that point you'll have some NASTY vibrations at speed, and you'll bust the u-joints out of it the first time you put any sort of load on it.

    a stumble on decel is either a decel fuel cut, the IAC opening too quickly/sticking, the EGR valve cycling, or an ignition problem- bad wire, bad pickup, or worst case a worn timing chain.
     
  20. You make the assumption that just because your engine is relatively new it's inconceivable that there could be a mechanical issue such as bad plug wires, fouled plugs, or carbon buildup. If you really knew much about automotive things you would know that "new" doesn't mean shit. I've bought plenty of parts and seen plenty of "new" parts that don't work as they're supposed to. Each thing deus mentioned could have caused your problem. Of course you dismiss them all out of hand because your truck is not old enough for those to be your problem.

    And also, I don't care how much better a truck handles if you lower it 3 or 4 inches, trucks handle like shit... full stop. The steering is vague, the brakes suck, there's little traction over the drive wheels, and the aerodynamics are junk. To make it even worse you bought a mopar vehicle. As lame as most ford and chevy trucks are they are like mercedes compared to the trash that dodge sells.

    If I had to guess, I'd say your driveability issue is just related to the fact that dodge makes shitty vehicles with all sorts of problems. I wouldn't be surprised if it was related to two or three things that are wrong.


    If you ask for people's advice don't be an ass when someone offers reasonable ideas.
     
  21. 00600

    00600 New Member

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    Yeah, but atleast he's got a stick instead of a 46RE:rofl:
     
  22. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    ok so ive had 3 fo these, 1 was 1997 with 180,000+ miles, a 2002 with 50,000 miles and now a 2004 with 16,000 miles. both my 97 and 02 did not do what i am discribing at all. i would amagin after 180k miles id start to have carbon build up or bad plug wire problems?

    that just doesnt make sense to me based ont the fact that ive had more of these and not the same problem. sure it could be a fluke thing but i still think its something in the rearend. although timing chain makes sense, i just dont see a timing chain waring out after 16k :dunno:?

    also i dont think you are exactly understanding what im talking about the truck doesnt surge on its own throttling up and down, its when im off the throttle and it feels like i have slop in the driveline somewhere letting it bounce back and forth like a seesaw.

    :ugh: my 97 handled better then most cars ive driven(and i was a lot porter for about year so ive driven alot of cars and trucks). have you even driven a lowered v8 dakota? my brakes were great, ABS and all, streering felt great aswell it would powerslide like hot knife through butter, great steering responce and angle for that kinda stuff.

    mopar is trash? explain to me how my 97 went to 180,000+ miles no major problems then? :o this is just turning into a pissing contest now, and dont want any part of that. i not a huge fan of ford and i really want GM to bring the UTE over, i got a dakota becasue its the only midsize truck with a V8 5 speed single.

    if i had to guess id say thats the most bias statment ive heard in a while and i wouldnt be surpised if you continued this pissing contest full of lies.

    reasonable ideas? seafoam in a 16k mile engine? have you been living under a rock? do you even post of these forums? havnt you seen this guys other posts in threads, give me a break. i dont care if his ideas are even slightly creditable hes the last person im gonna take advice from, im sorry.

    homework:o >

    http://forums.offtopic.com/showthread.php?t=3401434
    http://forums.offtopic.com/showthread.php?t=3369270
     
  23. Is English your first language?

    Further, if I am biased it's because I know that overall, dodge vehicles are junk. Look at the crap they foist on the car-buying public. Look at the JD Power initial quality rankings.

    Honestly, if you think a lowered pickup truck is a good handling vehicle, then there's no amount of logic I can use that will make you understand why it's not. I don't know what other cars you have driven that make you think you're onto something with your truck's handling, but they can't have been very good. Maybe you were a lot porter at a dodge dealer.
     
  24. 00600

    00600 New Member

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    If you turn off the radio and A/C and listen carefully when it does this, is there a faint whining noise, or a change in pitch?

    Dodges are famous for excessive backlash. The good news is they have threaded adjusters, so if that's what it is, and the damage isn't too bad, you can sometimes tighten it up a little.

    Do you have access to a depth micrometer on a magnetic base?
     
  25. Fareo

    Fareo New Member

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    lets not bring out the grammar nazi's, im not a english major and its pretty obivious. i know alot about cars, music, and videogames, nowhere in that requires me to be a grammar nazi? lets try to be atleast alil mature.

    how do you know this? have you conducted road test agianst other cars for thousands of miles? have worked for different car dealers as a tech? or did you listen to what someone else told you? weather it be your buddy "shaddy jimmy" or JD power?

    either way its someone elses opinion to help you decide weather you want the car or not. reviewers, and car testers are like weather men, some times there right sometimes there way off and sometimes there kinda in the middle. i had a really good experiance with both of my other dakotas, they were tough got the job done and fun to drive, ive seen the consumer reports on them, but i havent had any of those problems with mine?

    sure you could say that "your just too dumb to see it" or some stupid shit like that but honestly you know im right. you know that even tho a car can get a -3 out ten score someone out there could have got the diamond in the rough. just because some people say they dont like them or have problems doesnt mean it sucks. your not buying 60% of the dodges your buying 1, if that 1 works fine then whats the big fuckin deal? jimmys broke? well jimmy needs a lucky rabbits foot or something because my truck works fine.

    honestly every car company sucks, it comes down to personal experiances. i know peolpe who have owned chevys that lasted for decades and no problems, they sware by chevy and wont by anything else... at the same time i know people that cant own a chevy for a month without something breaking. you honestly have to just find the car that works for you and the best built out of the litter.

    so unless you can provide something other then a OT membership im gonna say that your opinion on quality of cars is NOT the bottom line, because your telling me "what you've heard" is that they are crap. when im telling you "what ive experianced" is that they are just fine.

    i never said my truck could out handle a porsche, talk about 1 extreme to another. FOR A TRUCK the dakotas handle really well, and are fun to drive. ive driven lots of stuff spaning from camaros, mustangs, civics, 3500 desiel crew cab long beds, elements, acorrd wagons, 3000gt's and so on. yes it was for a dodge dealer, but why does that matter? we still had used cars and trade in's? i drove more non-dodge cars then i did dodge, and i picked dodge because at the time i was driving my 1967 charger so i could get a discount on parts and i also knew the service manager. :o

    this thread has gotten way of course... :squint:
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2007

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