Price me a Dream Server Plz

Discussion in 'OT Technology' started by Peyomp, Dec 16, 2008.

  1. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    I'm waiting on a long process to finish, and I can't do crap until its done because its profiling and I can't load the machine up.

    I'm tired of doing hardcore computing on a notebook. I'm thinking about getting a Mac Pro next year. Thing is, no way I'm paying for the beefy shit they sell. Fuck Apple and their $10K for a workstation.

    I'm looking at this: http://store.apple.com/us/product/FA970LL/A?mco=MjE0NDk5Mw

    $2300 for a base refurb Mac Pro - dual 2.8 Ghz quad cores.

    I'd need to take the RAM to 8GB. Yes, I use it. I wail on Postgres all day long, MySQL is also running, and I run a lot of programs at once in my workflow - lots of FF tabs, Mail.app, Tweetdeck, Adium, Calendar on/off, my timer app, terminals, apache, a virtualbox ubuntu machine, Excel, etc. I don't know what RAM I need or how expensive it is.

    I also want 'fuck-you fast' disks for database stuff and file searches. I don't want to pay for a RAID controller, and as much as I love them SAS disks are probably out of my budget. So I need 3 fast SATA drives. 10K rpm, 15K rpm... whatever is available thats fast. I don't keep up, and I don't know whats a good value. I intend to put them on a 3 disk RAID-Z zpool, and put everything but the OS on those disks.

    Then, I will remote desktop in and work on the beast. It won't even have a monitor. Well, maybe... I'll put Windows on there so I can finally play my brother's games.
     
  2. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Other World Computing/64FB2MPK08GB/ This place says 8GB is only $185. Not bad.

    2 * 74GB usable space for 148GB at $360: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136033

    2 * 150GB usable space for 300GB at $510: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136296

    Hmmm... might make sense to get the 3 * 74s, and put code and DBs there. And then if I need more space, get another drive. But I doubt I will, I use S3. So the 74s would do me right.

    So thats... $545 in upgrade parts needed, on top of the $2300. Thats not bad for an 8GB/dual quad core/fast as fuck SATA/RAIDZ workstation... hmmm...

    Am I missing anything here? This seems like an economical way to get a bad ass workstation.
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2008
  3. piratepenguin

    piratepenguin New Member

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    Well if you're going for OS X is it that necessary to post to OT to ask for choices lol

    How quick (snappy) will remote desktop be?
     
  4. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    The questions pertain to the accessories. I don't really know if that is good RAM, or if those are the best disks. I don't know hardware.

    Almost all of my work is done from home, so it would be on the LAN. I don't know how snappy remote desktop will be, but I'm sure it will be fast enough. For coding, it will probably be fast enough across a link even. Faster than waiting on my slow ass notebook disk drive and running out of RAM.
     
  5. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    It has been suggested that one SSD would outperform 3 velociraptors in a RAIDZ/5 array.
     
  6. trouphaz

    trouphaz New Member

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    why use remote desktop? just build a hooked up PC and run Linux on it. then ssh.
     
  7. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    Because OS X would still pinwheel on me when doing certain things. I want the power on the desktop.
     
  8. piratepenguin

    piratepenguin New Member

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    Your connection over the internet will be a bottleneck, so speedy SSD performance will be a little underfelt. You know more about how that will affect you though.

    Aren't SSDs pretty-common for database servers and the like?
     
  9. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    I usually work from home, so there won't be a net connection, just wifi/ethernet. At the moment the main bottleneck on the macbook is diskage, and I want to overkill that problem. I think I will feel and enjoy the speed.

    SSDs are common, I guess, but the X-25 is like $500+. Exceeds my budget.
     
  10. trouphaz

    trouphaz New Member

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    i just mean make the OSX system simple a front end and do all of your processing elsewhere. put your databases and apache on this other system and drop the VirtualBox Ubuntu in favor of an actual Ubuntu system. just those 3 things should help.

    the obvious limitation is that it is much less portable and if you plan on accessing this from somewhere else, you're kind of screwed.
     
  11. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    It may be worthwhile to use an external ubuntu system, but I want a beast of a desktop anyway. I figure an 8 core behemoth can handle all of this.
     
  12. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    Dell PowerEdge 2950. Dual quad-cores (2GHz each), 8GB ECC DDR2, 6x SAS RAID5, redundant power supply, Windows Server 2003 x64, for ~$4200. I have three of them in my office, running several virtual machines each. I love them to pieces.

    Even one of the VMs with 2 cores and 2GB of RAM allocated can whip any of the "real" workstations in the office, even the dual-Xeons with 1.5GB of Rambus RAM.
     
  13. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    But thats more money for less machine, and the wrong OS?
     
  14. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    I missed the part where you absolutely had to have OSX on it; if it's actually going to be a server, and not just a superdesktop (i.e. the user interface doesn't matter), you could throw OpenSolaris on it and call it a day. Hell, you could even buy it with VMware Server Linux pre-installed and pre-configured. Can Apple do that for you?

    It's not really more money for less machine. Does that Mac Pro have a six-disk SAS RAID in it? (You don't have to get the RAID, but 6 SAS disks would still kick ass -- or you could opt for an SATA RAID instead.) How about 3-years no-questions-asked parts replacement with overnight shipping? And I see it doesn't have the 8GB RAM you wanted or the stupid-fast disks, either.

    Hell...you could put VMware Server 2.0 on it, with DirectX 9.0 support, and run your brother's games in a Windows VM. Alongside a game server to host deathmatches. While also running SQL and all that other shit in other VMs alongside it. If that doesn't make you a little wet between the cheeks, nothing will.
     
  15. trouphaz

    trouphaz New Member

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    if you're going to run OSX, you're going to have to suck it up and buy a MacPro. you might want to check the Mac Shack. :)
     
  16. dissonance

    dissonance reset OT Supporter

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  17. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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  18. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    Arg, you have to get the RAID card to have SAS drives, and its $800.
     
  19. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    They don't know anything about parts.
     
  20. dissonance

    dissonance reset OT Supporter

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    There are motherboards with built in SAS controllers.
     
  21. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    True. But I want to run OS X and couldn't find much info about doing so on a Mac Pro clone. Not sure how that would work out?
     
  22. dissonance

    dissonance reset OT Supporter

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    SSDs are great but for a server but I highly doubt you want to spend that much for one that would work good with what you want.

    One downside to actually getting Xeon CPUs is that you are going to be using ECC buffered RAM (more than likely at least, I don't know alot about Xeons). It is quite a bit more expensive than your regular desktop RAM.

    Are you open to building a server yourself or are you just wanting to buy a prebuilt one?
     
  23. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    In a server, the limited lifetimes of SSDs is also a significant issue.

    I'm pretty sure Xeons don't require ECC RAM, but the motherboards that support them do use ECC-compatible memory controllers pretty much universally. On the other hand, never having a memory error over years of continuous operation will pay for the cost of ECC in unlost productivity. If any scenario would result in a memory error these days, it would be running several VMs with duties ranging from virtual workstations to full-out database servers. While the virtual workstations have bluescreened a couple of times (driver errors, fixed with Windows Repairs), the worst that's happened to the host servers is the onboard LCD turned orange and threw a memory fault code, which was remedied by a free overnight shipment of replacement RAM.

    I don't know if you're still considering the Dell PowerEdge 2950, but I checked and you can definitely get a non-RAID SAS controller.
     
  24. trouphaz

    trouphaz New Member

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    so, what's the point of this thread anyway? you want to buy a mac pro, but don't want to pay the apple tax. you want to run OSX, but don't want to be ass raped by apple for their hardware.

    i'll be honest, even with all of the stuff you want to run, i doubt if you'd need all of the hardware you plan on buying. just install linux on a single proc, quad-core system and run your databases and web server there and you'll be fine. get 4 drives, mirror 2 for your OS and 2 for your data. use your laptop for all of your GUI type apps, Office, Firefox, etc. connect to the linux box using SSH. you could probably build a pretty decent system for around $1000. spend a bit more and throw in a video card and you'll have a decent gaming rig as well.
     
  25. BlazinBlazer Guy

    BlazinBlazer Guy Witness to The De-Evolution of Mankind.

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    Peyomp: look at EFI-X if you want a clone that runs OSX.

    And as for SSDs, let me tell you from experience as the "hardware guy" in a large datacenter, they SUCK. Stay away unless you're buying the absolute best SSDs out there which are EXPENSIVE as FUCK.
     

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