LGBT oral sex/hiv

Discussion in 'Lifestyle' started by fraternitymemoirs12, Mar 17, 2007.

  1. fraternitymemoirs12

    fraternitymemoirs12 New Member

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    Wow, it's been a long time since I last posted. I was coming out, and I had all the fun that comes with that...

    ...this is like my rant forum. But this time I totally asked for it. Maybe you'll ROTFLOL from the paranoia, or maybe not.

    So last night I was really horny so I met a guy online, and having no experience I just went for it. This was pretty much my second time, ever. I just had oral with the guy. Not bad.

    Then I go to his bathroom, and because I've studied pharmacology before, I see a prescription for three antiviral drugs used for AIDS. The bastard lied.

    So, am I screwed? I know it was just oral, I don't have cuts anywhere really, and the guy didn't come (although precum and all that), but I have this nagging doubt that I'll be that one unlucky guy that balances everything all out. Any thoughts?
     
  2. UpPy

    UpPy Guest

    Get checked...even if its only for your own piece of mind.....
     
  3. fraternitymemoirs12

    fraternitymemoirs12 New Member

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    I'm getting checked in two weeks/month. Anything to calm the nerves until then? It's the price you pay for being stupid, I guess.
     
  4. nathanb

    nathanb New Member

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    If he didn't cum in your mouth and neither one of you had cuts in the affected areas you should be reasonably safe. However, you do need to get tested, and you could also have gotten other STDs.
     
  5. ManyHamsters

    ManyHamsters There are necessary pursuits... but poetry, beauty

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    i'd personally find out about taking those morning-after drugs, just in case...
     
  6. XPX

    XPX New Member

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    :werd: on m orning after drugs...just to be safe


    and now you know why everyone stresses on the condom all the time
     
  7. fraternitymemoirs12

    fraternitymemoirs12 New Member

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    Is it that easy to get the morning after PEP pills? It seems like a lot of local hospitals are like, we don't know what to do about that situation.

    I wish I had just an iota more common sense. Good lord I'm an idiot. I hope someone reads this and learns how much trouble and doubt you go through for one stupid, lousy, idiotic mistake.
     
  8. 2500

    2500 Guest

    ok, the common misconception is "open cut." you don't need a 4 inch chunk missing out of your mouth to get AIDS. even brushing your teeth too hard before you do it is enough. we're talking blood. blood is a liquid, and can get into the tiniest little spot. if marbles gave you AIDS, then yeah, maybe you would notice the "cut" but we're talking a liquid. and no HIV test is conclusive unless its been 6 months with NOTHING. so, yeah, a few weeks won't cut it because it COULD take up to 6 months for the HIV to show on the blood test. This is why i stopped meeting guys for hookups. 2 hours of fun, then i worry for the next 6 months. not worth it. hope everything turns out ok for you. let us know in 6 months.
     
  9. fraternitymemoirs12

    fraternitymemoirs12 New Member

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    yeah, I've heard of the not brushing your teeth thing - I hadn't done it since the morning before, and after the fact I obviously didn't brush my teeth for like 4 hours (while I was wide awake and freaked out).

    again, as he says, it isn't worth it. if one small part of your brain is doubting yourself, do anything - call a friend, jack off, find anybody - but do anything BUT go through with something so stupid. man oh man.
     
  10. 2500

    2500 Guest

    it actually took me about 4 "f*ck this" episodes before i actually did it, so, stay strong. after 6 months, i would say "well, i'm fine, so, i guess its ok." then as SOON as i was done, i'm like "ok, here we go for another 6 months." i learned if i'm talkin to someone online, just start jerkin off. exchange pics, and, by the time you blow, your like "shit, glad i didn't go through with this." lol. but by far my best decision, is i found my soul mate. i have sex 4-5 times a day, every day, and never have to worry about anything. and sex is SO much better when it means something.
     
  11. marxwa99

    marxwa99 Boom Squad

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    i work doing hiv prevention and education, and hiv testing and counseling is one thing i do.

    The advice 2500 gave is pretty much on spot. Unprotected oral sex is less risky than unprotected anal/vaginal sex. However, if there are open cuts and sores in the mouth or on the penis, yes, that can be an issue. Even the slightest cut, even if from just brushing/flossing, can be a potential risk.

    I would also suggest an STD screening, because although oral sex is low risk for HIV, it is still high risk for STDS such as gonorrhea, chlymidia, and syphilis.

    Also to further explain the 6 month window period, the HIV test, whether blood or an oral swab, which is what i use, searches for HIV antibodies, not HIV itself. When one's body is infected with HIV, the body creates antibodies in efforts to combat the virus's attack on the immune system. And the test detects these antibodies. However, for the test to bring back a positive result, there has to be a certain level of antibodies abundant in the body. For the average human being, this can be anywhere from 3-6 months.

    With that said, let's say someone was infected with HIV 10 days ago and then got tested today. His test could very well come back NEGATIVE because he didnt have enough antibodies in his body to create a positive result. So he tested negative even when he was in fact positive.

    Lastly, most places in the U.S. have places for HIV testing that is free and anonymous. My first responsibility is making sure that the person being tested feels as comfortable throughout the whole testing experience as possible.

    I can go into HIV antibody testing much more in detail if you or anyone else have any questions, whether on here or via PM.

    Yeah, the end got a bit counseling clinical-ish. But this is one big thing i do in my field of work :)
     
  12. XPX

    XPX New Member

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    Thanks Marx, you can go on detail here...it is never too early to learn about that :cool:

    Are those morning after pills effective? How do they work?

    I don't get why people hesitate so much about the condom...looks so easy and the benefits are immense....(I wouldn't know, I carry the big V card :mamoru: )
     
  13. fraternitymemoirs12

    fraternitymemoirs12 New Member

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    well, condoms are just something that no one wants to suck on. at least I had the self-restraint to limit everything to oral, but with that there's still risk. I think a lot of gay guys don't think oral is much to worry about and I bought into that.

    this is my first "f*ck it" episode and will definitely be my last. like you said, I need a boyfriend, and badly. and this was my wake-up call.

    thanks marx for the very detailed advice - it will definitely help anyone who reads this thread. freaking out after the incident, I read up on a million resources online, and yeah, I am aware of the 3-6 month window period, where you can show up negative because your antibodies haven't developed to the HIV virus, but you can still infect others because you've got the virus in your system.

    I guess my question is the same as xpx's, though, how effective is nPEP - to clear up one misconception though, it's not just taken the morning after, you gotta take it for a month, and it's got lots of side effects, and it's expensive. is the risk of side effects worth it given the somewhat low risk of the encounter?
     
  14. fraternitymemoirs12

    fraternitymemoirs12 New Member

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    oh by the way, I don't mean to be harsh, but when I still had the v-card (for 23 f*cking years of my life), I was judgmental as hell, but you know what they say - sometimes, you don't really know until it's happened to you.

    This is only my second encounter in my entire life, the first being with a friend (sort of) who I knew was pretty much safe (I tested 3, 6 months later and was fine).

    Advice for the virgins (which I've already told all my gay friends out there) - consider any possible situation that you might get yourself into the future, come up with a course of action, and stick to it. for example, I told myself that I'd stick to oral until I found a boyfriend. a really obvious thing I didn't consider is, if this is a random hookup, I should use a condom. even for oral.

    duh! but in the heat of the moment, if you haven't thought about it beforehand, sometimes you really just lose your mind and it's all about the set "program" you had coming into it. so I just had unprotected oral, obviously not even thinking of the fact that he might be lying about his hiv status. hopefully any v-card holders out there won't have to learn this lesson the hard way.

    oh, and how did I find out? after the decidedly so-so sex, I went to his bathroom, where I found a prescription for saquinavir, indinavir, and tenofovir. don't know what those are? part of HAART therapy. why do I know this? because I'm a fucking second-year med student. that's right folks, even your future doctors can be this stupid. I ratted him out and he was all stupid and speechless and boy was I pissed. I'm still just so angry at myself for being sooooooooo naive and for him for just being a lousy liar.
     
  15. marxwa99

    marxwa99 Boom Squad

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    The "morning-after pill" does get expensive, has to be taken with full adherence (ie miss any doses and it greatly drops in effectiveness), and can have side effects. From my knowledge, this is mainly used for medical situations (ie being stuck with a needle) and SHOULD NOT be used as protection or safer sex in my opinion.

    Wear a condom, talk with partners about HIV status, know, understand and acknowledge the risks.

    If you mess up, acknowledge the mistake, get tested after the window period, but also realize that if you used condoms all the other times, your risk is still greatly lower than someone who barebacks nonstop with multiple partners
     
  16. novo

    novo Pokey Man OT Supporter

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    what were the prescriptions that you found?

    I am not aware which drugs are prescribed for HIV and would like to know to keep a look out.
     
  17. fraternitymemoirs12

    fraternitymemoirs12 New Member

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    haha, you've asked for it now. straight from my lecture notes, the aids lecture was taught by one of our deans:

    current haart therapy is (2 nucleoside reverse transcriptase inhibitors (NRTI) + 1 non-nucleoside reverse transcriptase inhibitor (NNRTI)) or (1 NRTI, 1 NNRTI, and 1 protease inhibitor (PI)); of course each doctor may prescribe differently on a case-to-case basis.

    • nucleoside RT inhibitors
      • AZT (zidovudine), ddI, ddC, 3TC (lamivudine), d4T (stavudine), abacavir
    • nucleotide RT inhibitor
      • tenofovir
    • NNRT inhibitors
      • nevirapine, delavirdine, efavirenz
    • protease inhibitors
      • saquinavir, indinavir, ritonavir, lopinavir, amprenavir, nelfinavir
    • HIV entry inhbitors
      • enfuvirtide
      [*]and there's lots of new experimental ones that are probably too costly for the average Joe
    Basic rule: if ya see a "vir" in it, it's probably for AIDS. Especially if you see three drugs in combination.
    Exceptions:
    acyclovir, ganciclovir, famciclovir, or cidofovir - used to treat herpes
    zanamavir or oseltamivir - used to treat the flu
    ribavirin - used to treat lots of things (flu and a few rare viruses)

    ...

    I guess if there's anything to be learned from shows like Grey's Anatomy and ER, it's that doctors (and med students), for whatever they may or may not know, are just as human as anybody else. Sigh.
     
  18. ManyHamsters

    ManyHamsters There are necessary pursuits... but poetry, beauty

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    *e-hug*

    we're here for you man, good or bad

    :)
     
  19. marxwa99

    marxwa99 Boom Squad

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    also should note that not everyone living with hiv necessarily needs meds. They usually start using them when their white blood cell count drops below 200 and their viral load is around 200,000-500,000. These meds have been documented to taking white blood cell counts up and viral loads to undetectable levels (usually a viral load of under 50). I know people living with HIV for years and still havent had to take a single pill. I know others that needed meds immediately

    However, these meds have to be taken rigidly. If you miss one dose, your chances of the virus becoming resilient to the meds increases tremendously. I think there's a 20% drop in effectiveness of still working with just one missed dosage.

    Think of it this way. Do you take a multivitamin? Then, do you take the multivitamin, everyday? THEN! Do you take it everyday, at the same time!?

    This is what people living with HIV has to go through. Living with HIV is not just popping a few pills. It is a complete lifestyle change, complete with possible side effects from the pills.

    And every person i know living with HIV has said the same thing. You never forget that you are living with HIV cause every pill you take is a reminder that you are HIV+.

    Despite this, i know many great individuals who are moving onward with their lives and have said that being diagnosed with HIV was an opportunity to be reborn, get their shit straightened out, and live life to the fullest.
     
  20. camarosrool

    camarosrool yes i am

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    so are you more contagious if your viral load is high enough where you need meds?
     
  21. marxwa99

    marxwa99 Boom Squad

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    the short answer is yes.

    here is the long answer:

    When one is first infected, the viral load in their body skyrockets. Then the body learns to control it (but never destroy it completely). The viral load decreases. Meds then may come into play which suppresses the viral load as well. When people are dying from AIDS-related complications, their viral loads skyrocket again. So theoretically, the time in which a person can easily transmit HIV is at the beginning and the end of the epidemic.

    Hope that makes sense.
     
  22. marxwa99

    marxwa99 Boom Squad

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    This is additional information on adherence to HIV meds (ie. consisently taking the meds) from a colleague who works at Ohio State University's Clinical AIDS Trials Center.

    ********
    There was a study done out of Chicago a few years back looking at adherence.

    If patients were 95% adherent they had an 81% chance of attaining viral suppression (i.e. 81% possibility that the virus did not become resistant)

    90-95% adherent – 64% chance of suppression

    80-90% adherent – 50% chance

    70-80% adherent – 25% chance

    < 70% adherent – 6%

    What this means that if you take your medications twice a day you cannot miss more than one dose every 7-10 days to be 95% adherent. If you take your medications once a day, then you cannot miss more than a dose every two weeks or so to remain 95% adherent.

    ********

    Like i said, very hard for some people to do. There are actually clinics out there (California is one place i know) where people make daily app'ts to have the staff actually watch them take the meds. And as much work as it is, it works!

    When people talk about the effects of METH in the gay community, HIV+ people are also included. Not only has Meth been found to make the progression of HIV on the body increase (recent study from July 2006), but people on it usually forget to take their meds, and to tell others!

    When superstrains are talked about in NYC and most recently, Seattle, it is usually from Injection-Drug Users. They forget to take meds, making the meds no longer able to fight the strain of HIV that they are infected with. They end up passing HIV to someone else and that person also can't take those meds. If this continues to be passed amongst a community, more meds become ineffective. More or less, with a superstrain of HIV, you are paying for others' errors. Taking meds is so important!
     
  23. fraternitymemoirs12

    fraternitymemoirs12 New Member

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    thanks marxwa99, your advice on here is invaluable, and hopefully my stupid mistake will not be repeated by others.

    I was lucky enough to find a nearby community clinic, where I got the prophylactic medication (just in time for the 72 hour window) for free (good lord I'm lucky), just had to pay out of pocket for liver function tests (std testing covered by the California Health Access Programs, lucky again).

    As lucky as I am to practically be coddled through the process here - folks, just don't even get involved in the first place and save yourself the trouble. Find a boyfriend, get tested, and then f*ck him crazy. Seriously.
     
  24. stolid_agnostic

    stolid_agnostic One who is both stolid and agnostic. Get a diction

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    stop being paranoid! it's not really going to happen that way

    second, assume that the person has it beforehand. it's bullshit that people are expected to tell everyone, rather than people assume that they have it.
     
  25. stolid_agnostic

    stolid_agnostic One who is both stolid and agnostic. Get a diction

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    I heard a doctor once say that most doctors don't make it through the regimine after needle sticks because the side effects are so bad
     

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