A&P need help on pricing for: food photography and nightclub (candid) shots

Discussion in 'Lifestyle' started by pantheR, Aug 6, 2009.

  1. pantheR

    pantheR New Member

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    i know the rates for food go from 30/hr up to 60/hr, but how do you factor in how many edited photos you supply in the end? do you charge by each usable image?

    secondly, a bar manager here in columbus needs some nightclub shots of people. assuming i have the correct equipment (still working on that), how much should i charge? he simply needs photos of a busy bar packed with people, for the website. again; hourly or per photo?

    thanks fellas
     
  2. Fucker

    Fucker out of the fast lane, bitches

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    you "know" huh? where the hell did you get those bullshit rates? no pro food shooters charge by the hour.

    pro food shooters base their fees on usage; packaging vs. advertising vs. editorial x area (local, regional, national, international) x length of time ( 1 year, 5 years, life of the package, unlimited aka full buyout) = fee per shot.

    your estimate should detail the number of shots & how they'll be used and for how long. you should go in knowing exactly what you're shooting. ask for an advance to cover your expenses and crew, 20%-30% of the estimated expenses is typical. deliver only what you contracted to deliver and don't give away the ps work. pro quality retouching goes for $125 (high end up to $300) per hour but you can find good freelancers working in the $40 range. if you have retouching on your estimate call it "postproduction" and mark it up, at least twice what you're being charged but no more than market for your area.

    food stylist, also called home economists in some markets, run $600-1200 per day + their assistant + shopping (groceries), depending your market and the project. prop stylists are in the same range + rental fees or prop construction fees. no food shoot can be successful without a food stylist, at least none that i've ever seen. chefs or cooks aren't always good at this, food prep to shoot is not the same as cooking to eat. but you might get lucky.

    if you're shooting in a private club, you'll need model releases from everyone in the club and a property release from the club to cover your bases.

    of course this is all provided you're a good photographer and can deliver. amateurs that charge by the hour and give shit away devalue the market for everyone else and makes it hard for you to get away from being the "cheap guy". might be fine now, but when the economy bounces back, you've fucked yourself. i would never hire a photographer that charges by the hour and that didn't know the basics i've outlined here because i'd know you have no idea what your doing.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2009
  3. ok_computer

    ok_computer OT Supporter

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    I would be fucking FLOORED if a professional food shooter only charged $50/hour.
     
  4. pantheR

    pantheR New Member

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    Guess I forgot to mention i'm not a pro yet, thanks though
     
  5. johan

    johan Active Member

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    guys, he's not really talking about pro-level food photography.

    Those "rates" sound like someone who shot a couple of sushi trays for a small, local jap shack.
    No food stylist, no pro lighting, nothing. Just a GWAC and a macro lens.
     
  6. Fucker

    Fucker out of the fast lane, bitches

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    hey bro, just trying to help. answer the questions and i'll help you price your stuff.
     
  7. oliver

    oliver New Member

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    :hsugh: Not really.

    he didnt say private first off and second of all if you're in a club and you 'allow' a photographer to take your picture that's pretty much all the right you need unless the person is a complete fucking douchenozzle. I work in clubs every week and i've yet to encounter somoene this douchey in the past year or two of work. You can ask turbodude as well he will probably agree. Its not that serious :hs: If you are going to sue someone over taking your pic and posting it, i'm sure you would just tell them right then and there "please dont take my photograph".
     
  8. Fucker

    Fucker out of the fast lane, bitches

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    yes really. in this case you have a point, he's an amateur and is probably ok. i'm not a photographer and i'm not up on the law in NY state. but if the club owner starts using the pictures for advertising and someone in the ad sees themselves, they can sue. especially if the person is doing something stupid and the picture damages his/her standing in the community or causes them to loose a job via an ethics clause in their contract. maybe someone is being inappropriate with someone that isn't their spouse. the injured party can sue the photographer & the club and they'd win. even if they don't win, you still have to defend yourself and no lawyer i've ever met works for free. i've sat in meeting with attorneys about these issues. we live in a litigious society and it happens. people out of work can be especially douchenozzley, but you're free to run your business any way you like.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2009
  9. IntheWorks

    IntheWorks windin film.. takin pics Moderator

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    Paging Mr. Powers... Mr. Powers, please come to OTAP... Mr. Powers, please come to OTAP
     
  10. Valence

    Valence Gustav Refugee

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    I'm very interested in knowing if you really do need a release. I've read somewhere that if you shoot in a public place you can sell your work without a release, that simply by being in public you have no reasonable expectation to compensation or privacy. Since you're in a privately owned club and not in what could be considered a truly "public" place, I'd tend to agree with needing releases.
     
  11. turbodude

    turbodude Just a photographer OT Supporter

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    Regarding the Nightlife stuff. I have yet to see a nightclub anywhere that does not have a sign that says you may be photographer, and in tiny print it says they can use your picture.

    So... You dont need a model release because by entering the nightclub you are agreeing to have your photo taken.

    Every club i have ever worked for, or even been in to party has had this type of sign somewhere near the ropes or cashier. Whether it be a 8x11 sheet of paper, or a full blown sign, its there. And i do men every club. BTW, whats the difference between a "private club" and a public one? I dont think there is a difference. But if there is such thing as a private club, you probably have ties in with the owner/proprietor, or pay a monthly fee to enter this club and im sure there is a contract or some sort of document that was shown to you, or you have signed to gain membership into such a venue. In regards to a lawsuit... If you are hired into the nightclub as an employee of the venue, and the venue decides to use a photograph that you took in advertising, and someones going to sue about it, they can "try" to sue you, but you will typically be under a blanket of the venue, because you were working as an employee. And no they wouldnt win, due to what i stated before. Key in point look at the book "Hot Girls with Douchebags" The company i work for pretty much supplied 95% of the images in that book, people have tried suing, threatening, etc... and what happened? Our lawyers shot down every claim they had and the litigation ended as fast as it started.

    As far as the food photography thing, there is a definite line that gets drawn between a true food photographer, and a photographer who photographs food. When i have been hired to do food photography, i dont charge an hourly rate, its typically a flate rate which includes licensing for editorial and commercial use. It depends on how many dishes they want photographed, as well as setting etc. Like i said, i have never been in a nightclub that didnt have this disclaimer document somewhere in the front, and i have been in alot of nightclubs San Diego, Texas, NYC, Miami, Tampa, San Jose, LA, Ft Lauderdale, Vegas, etc... They all have them.

    I am not a food photographer by any means, those people are super critical and i have the utmost respect for that level of work. Its meticulous, and very time consuming. Ive read countless books on the subject, worked as an assistant to a couple local photogs in town that only do food and drinks, and i know thats not something i ever want to do as a profession. But it takes a strong creative background as well as a acute attention to the slightest detail.

    I wish you luck, read a bunch of Lou Manna's books. Look at some of Colin Cooke's work, Dennis Davis, hell famous stock photographer, Yuri Arcurs, has some excellent food photography as well.

    Definitely do your research prior to, i have turned down numerous food photography jobs, simply because i know what the client wants, and i wouldnt be able to deliver.
     
  12. turbodude

    turbodude Just a photographer OT Supporter

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    If you are in a public place and take a picture of someone, yes you dont need a model release IF the image is used for EDITORIAL CONTENT, if you plan on using it as a stock image or selling the image to someone and using it for anything other than editorial use, then yes you will need a model release.
     

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