SRS My daughter's mother just wants money...

Discussion in 'On Topic' started by verbal, May 18, 2009.

  1. verbal

    verbal Active Member

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    My ex is pulling some shit on me and taking my time away from my daughter just because she wants more money cause she's struggling with her bills. We have a hearing in July because she isn't happy with the amount the state thinks she should get. I've fought with her numerous times and all she says is she's struggling and thinks she should get more money because of our daughter. I've explained that it's child support, not mother support-- I'm not required to pay for her bills that she decided to take on. The only factors for Michigan child support are both our incomes, insurance, and nights we each have the child.

    I'm sure she plans on telling the judge some things about me but they have no bearing on anything. I'm a good father, I don't do drugs, I drink socially, I make my child support payments all the time, and I take care of my daughter well when I have her. I know judges side with women all the time, but I don't see him giving her more support just because she says she's strugglilng with money, especially when she only works 20 hours a week.

    I guess I came here to vent and to see if anyone has had anything like this before and to hear how it turned out.
     
  2. GregFarz78

    GregFarz78 New Member

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    sucks dude some women are just bitches I bet she's not even using all that child support money on the kid either :sad2:
     
  3. verbal

    verbal Active Member

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    I know. Her only argument for needing more money is that she's struggling. Nothing about not being able to afford things our daughter needs, just that she can't pay her bills. Before we went to court, I was giving her $400/month. We saw a referree and they basically do the math with our incomes and all that and figure out what the state thinks she should get. That came out to $340. She was so upset. I planned on giving her $400 until it was set in stone, but now she's fighting with me so I just started giving her $350.

    I asked her to give me a detailed list of how she's spending $400 a month on our daughter. And I said that she doesn't need new clothes and toys that often. She didn't respond.

    I plan on writing her a nice, long, calm letter/email sometime this week.
     
  4. Ford4Life

    Ford4Life Guest

    This is pretty much standard these days, (SOME) women use kids as a pawn.

    If I were the judge, I would say similar. You have a duty to support the child, you aren't married to the mother and have no responsibilty to support her. My first suggestion would be she get a full time job.

    If you are in a position to do so, I'd make the argument that she is unable to financially care for your daughter, and seek full custody.

    Edit: Generalizations should be avoided in Asylum.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 20, 2009
  5. Sgt. Friday

    Sgt. Friday Guest

    I'd wait on that letter till after the hearing
     
  6. polishillusion

    polishillusion New Member

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    Sadly, (SOME) women get away with lying in court all the time. Can you verify that she is lying in court? That would help you out of lot.

    Edit: Generalizations should be avoided in Asylum.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2009
  7. verbal

    verbal Active Member

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    Hmmm..I could do that. You make a valid point. I could try, but unfortunately they'd only side with the father if you can prove the mother is unfit. I see finances falling into that catagory, but I'm not sure how good of an argument that could be.

    Hearing isn't until July. And I'm hoping by some miracle that I can get her to realize the harm she's doing. She has nothing but bad things to say about how her mother was a bad mother when she was growing up. Maybe I can get her to realize she's starting to go down the same path and it's just going to hurt our daughter in the long run. It's worth a try.

    She isn't lying about anything though. Some of the points she'll try to make are....

    1. I'm 31 and live with my father. I had a rough patch last year-- got laid off and my car died. We moved in with my father cause he has a house he's barely using. She moved out earlier this year. I take care of my daughter but my father still spoils her-- it's what grandparents do.

    2. She's under the assumption that out of the three days I have her, there are times that I leave her with father so I can go out for the night. It's very rare that I go out at night and if I do it's always after she's sleeping. So my father doesn't have to take care of her, he just has to hear her if she wakes up.

    3. I play poker often. It's true, I do, but it's a pasttime and a second source of income for me. I don't gamble out of control-- I don't gamble what I can't afford. I still pay child support and my bills on time. And it's charity poker-- most of what the house takes goes to charity. I rarely play at casinos.

    4. She thinks I don't buy things for my daughter. I buy her toys and clothes, but not every day or every week. She gets her necessities and then some. And I have all the receipts to show for it.

    Not sure why I just listed all those, but, whatever. Maybe I'll get some good feedback about it.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2009
  8. GregFarz78

    GregFarz78 New Member

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    and sadly the judge will side with the woman 90+% of the time

    just keep records of everything I hope it works out for you
     
  9. Fiasco

    Fiasco New Member

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    Why the fuck has no one said CALL YOUR LAWYER yet?

    If she's going to challenge custody or child support payments in anyway, CALL A PROFESSIONAL.

    Before you do anything or write anything down, CONSULT YOUR LAWYER.

    Maybe you have already... but I didn't read anything about it in your posts. My apologies if you have. :)

    Even by voluntarily increasing your payments to $350 that can be misconstrued as a sign that you have more liquid funds to support the child, hence making your higher payment mandatory.

    Good move asking her for a detailed list of her spending for the child. I don't suppose you intend on asking to see receipts do you? Just because she says she buys clothes doesn't mean she really has...

    Again... lawyer. :big grin:
     
  10. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    is that something your state might require? in mass, CT, and NH, you'd have no right to ask for that.

    horrible idea. no matter what you write, it can't help and can only hurt you.
     
  11. verbal

    verbal Active Member

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    I will be getting a lawyer. Going to talk to one or two soon.

    As for the payments, when she moved out and before this court stuff, we agreed on $400/mo. I paid that for a month, then we saw the ref who told us $337/mo is what the state forumla says. For a week I was trying to figure out what to do-- stay with the $400 till it was set in stone or just start at $337. We got in another huge fight right before I was supposed to pay her, so I just rounded it up to $350.

    I asked for a detailed list, but I'm not going to get it. I'm going to keep asking, but I'm sure I won't get it.

    Anyone know what a reasonable lawyer cost for this type of thing is? I really don't have a ton of money to spend on a lawyer and I don't want to get screwed. This is my first time ever paying for a lawyer.
     
  12. verbal

    verbal Active Member

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    Yeah, tried talking to her last night and it just turned into another fight. But how could a calm, non-attacking, non-insulting, to the point letter hurt me?

    I had this thought-- I already paid child support for this month. Which means I should still get my daughter on Tuesdays. And since court isn't until June, she'll be getting the regular payment in June. So I was trying to make her realize that me having her the Tuesdays until court aren't going to make anything better for her and it just takes father/daughter time away.

    Needless to say, she refused. I really don't undersatnd WHAT she thinks she's going to accomplish with this. She's just hurting our daughter so she can get more money. It's so pathetic. I'm going absolutely crazy right now.
     
  13. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    It doesn't matter what you write. In situations like this, every last tiny little bit of information about your life potentially puts you more at risk.

    It really is ridiculous how so many people seem to think that marrying a woman somehow fundamentally degrades her, such that she needs to be helped through life from there on out. I don't know how long you were married, but the bitch can get a full-time job like everyone else. Nobody is entitled to not have to pay for themselves if they possibly can -- certainly you shouldn't have to pay for her for the rest of her life, since she isn't even making it up to you in any way. Nobody seems to appreciate anymore that when one person works and the other stays home, the one who stays home had better damn well make it worth the breadwinner's while to keep paying for them.
     
  14. verbal

    verbal Active Member

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    I wouldn't be giving any information about my life. I'd be trying to make her realize what she's doing by just being after the money.

    We were never married. We were together 3.5 years and had a kid.

    I just had to share this text...

    Me: Can I please get a detailed list of how much you spend on Addison a month? Receipts if possible please.

    Her: No John. Why don't you ask some of your single mother friends what support is.

    Me: lol. I have. And they're getting the same as you in regards to both incomes and don't have an issue with it. It's life. Plus they work full time and aren't out for money and want their child to have time with their father.

    Her: You don't think three days a week is enough? (as in her only working three days a week.)

    Me: Are you serious? PLEASE explain why you fell it's my job to support you? How much was your mother working when she had all three of you? Almost all the women that I work with have 1-2 kids AND a husband that works. It's necessary these days. How much do the single female parents you know work?

    This is ridiculous. I've told her MANY times that it's child support, not mother support. We were never married-- I have no obligation to support her. I'm not sure why she thinks so.

    A friend just told me to get a decent lawyer (which I'm doing regardless) and go for joint custody. Joint in Michigan means no child support is paid and it's 50/50 custody. I think that might be the best option. Though I know her main argument will be that I'll need a sitter while I work, but that's life. She just doesn't seem to grasp that concept.
     
  15. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    ask it the other way...how could it help?

    it appears your ex- is being irrational so at BEST she'll ignore it. but at worst she can find something in it to use to point the finger at you for something she makes up.

    mention you went by on tuesday? she can tell the court she specifically told you not to go by and say you're harassing her.

    write that you think her actions are hurting your daughter? now she's got "proof" that you're bad mouthing her to your daughter.

    say you owe $340 but are sending $350? "proof" you've got extra money and that the court should re-examine the payment structure.




    ...........when you're dealing with someone who's going to lie to get whatever she wants, don't give her ammunition.
     
  16. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    Anything you write to her will just help her understand the way you think, and if the judge is male, probably helping her understand the way the judge thinks too. Better to leave her in the dark so she at least will be less successful in manipulating you. You're not going to help her see the error of her ways, because by refusing to throw yourself under the bus to help her and "your kid that she's taking care of for you", you're automatically the enemy.

    Well, if you were never married, then I guess all you're paying is child support, so at least you know it's got a finite lifespan.

    Her responses tell me she does in fact want more money, that she isn't spending all of the money she's getting on the kid, and she doesn't want anyone to find out. If the judge has half a brain he'll demand the same information you did -- unfortunately, there's no guarantee he'll have half a brain, or the patience to use it.
     
  17. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    why should she have to give you that? she's under no obligation to provide that, and if I was her I would have told you to go to hell for even asking.

    If she gathers a few of these, plus a letter, plus (my prediction) the restraining order she's going to try to get on you in the near future.........it's all evidence of harassment.

    Good luck. I hope it works out. A friend of mine divorced his lawyer wife and he got the house, kids, and monthly support. It can go in the guy's favor, but it's rare.
     
  18. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    She isn't obligated to give him that information, but if she wants the court to increase his child support, she will be obligated to give the court that information if the judge requests it. All the more reason to do things by the book.

    I don't agree that the second bit is harassment, though.
     
  19. verbal

    verbal Active Member

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    I get it. But our daughters two and isn't speaking, I could bad mouth her mother all I want but she wouldn't understand. :)

    And the payment structure is determined by our income and nights with the child. Nothing else is a factor.
     
  20. verbal

    verbal Active Member

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    wtf restraining order? I'm doing nothing to harass her. And I have no choice but to see her when I drop off my daughter.

    The things she's said to me are a LOT more nasty than anything I've said to her. I have every text we've sent since Christmas.
     
  21. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    the court? yes.

    him? no.

    wait until she makes up the stories to go along with it, about how he's always driving by, and calling and hanging up, and how he knocked on the door the other day and she answered and threatened to kill her if she didnt' let him see his daughter.
     
  22. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    When I was three my parents separated. My mother told my father she would take me away and never let me see him, because apparently women (maybe not all of them, but definitely a lot of them) can't detach from a relationship without feeling compelled to cause injury. My father was afraid she'd badmouth him to me constantly (and she probably would have, at that time), so he started telling me things about him and about the marriage so I'd have a clear picture. Granted, I'm smarter than most people (not trying to kiss my own ass, I have test scores to prove it), but I most definitely did understand what he was telling me. Your little girl is only a year younger -- which is a big difference at that age, but a year can go by really fast.

    7960, I can definitely believe she would make up stories like that, but whether the court will believe them is another matter. A couple of her friends who are sympathetic to him could make very good character witnesses -- and the neighbors can verify if they ever saw or heard anything of the sort.
     
  23. verbal

    verbal Active Member

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    I felt it didn't hurt to ask. Her argument is that I'm not giving enough to support our daughter. If that argument was so valid she should have no problems proving that she costs more than what I'm giving her. And in that case, I'd have NO problems giving her more money. It would save us both a lot of unncessary drama and stress.

    Heh, ok. I have no history of any of that. I know that means nothing, but it helps some. And if that's the case I don't think any of that without police reports would fly. I can't stand talking to her on the phone, so I text, and also so I have record of things she's said.
     
  24. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

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    In her mind, "enough to support our daughter" includes "enough to support her and our daughter", because of course she is obligated to be your daughter's caretaker and being a mom is a full-time job.

    This isn't about what makes sense. This is about instincts that have existed for millions of years, being rationalized by the conscious mind because the conscious mind likes getting fed.
     
  25. verbal

    verbal Active Member

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    I can see this being the case right here. Not sure if some of you remember my posts from six months ago. Our relationship had a lot of ups and downs. When things would blow up, she'd break up with me, and I'd be the one to come back trying to fix it, regardless of the circumstances. I was stupid.

    Anyway, the last time she ended it, I didn't care to fix it anymore. I was always the one putting the "fixing energy" into the relationship and she'd never work to get things back-- it was always me. She says that I'm the one that ended it. And she tells people that to this day.

    I know she wanted to be with me and didn't want to move, but she was way too "proud" to come to me and express her feelings and show that she wanted to work on it. When I didn't do it this time, she turned extremely bitter. It's been that way ever since. We've had our good spots, but it's usually fighting.
     

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