Linux crew (Ubuntu vs GNOME

Discussion in 'OT Technology' started by copeland, Sep 15, 2006.

  1. copeland

    copeland smarter than you

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    I'm looking at possibly ditching windows.
    where would the linux crew steer me to get into a good *nix OS for my esktop? I would really like to learn soemthing other then windows, and GNOME and Ubuntu look like they would be a good start

    currently I'm grabbing ubuntu 6.06
     
  2. MAD PUNK inDC

    MAD PUNK inDC Sic Semper Tyrannis

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    Ubuntu is probably the best precompiled linux to use for beginners. btw Gnome is the desktop enviroment, or gui used in Ubuntu. The next most common gui is KDE. There are several other desktop enviroments for linux, but thos are the top two. Debian is the linux distro or "flavor" that Ubuntu is based on. You have alot of various types out there. Debian, Fudora, and Suse are just a few from various vendors.
     
  3. JordanClarkson

    JordanClarkson OT Supporter

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    Ubuntu is an OS that has a great amount of hardware support. Gnome like KDE is a GUI. Ubuntu comes standard with Gnome and Kubuntu comes with KDE. SimplyMepis is a wonderful release of Ubuntu (uses KDE) as it includes a ton of packages. All of those are run on a live CD/DVD which you can also install onto the HD. You can also install a different GUI later on.

    The key is to be patient. It's definitely not as user friendly as Windows but is more fun to learn on.
     
  4. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    I've used both FedoraCore5 from RedHat and Ubuntu, recently. Both seem to be very good OSes but Ubuntu is currently getting a lot of love from the OT computer crew. I dunno, I'm too new to Linux to know which is better for my needs but right now, FC5 is meeting more of my needs then Ubuntu....but I haven't spent as much time with Ubuntu so we'll see.

    Either way, Lindsay Lohan is correct....be patient. It can be extremely frustrating when you have an issue. However, once you solve that issue it such a good feeling cuz you really have to work at some of these issues.
     
  5. copeland

    copeland smarter than you

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    cool thanks guys...so there a lots of apps for unbuntu making it a useful nix distro?

    I mean, will I be able to run some form of messenger, have an office package, or just straight up run some windows apps?

    or do I have to begin looking for actual programs released for ubuntu...

    I finished m ubuntu download, how difficult is it to install? should I make a dual boot setup or can it be run from disc like knoppix?
     
  6. piratepenguin

    piratepenguin New Member

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    Yup. Most of them will be installed by default, some wont. Most of them you can install via the package manager, synaptic, though. Just go to System > Admin > Synaptic Package manager, search for what you want and install it.
    Yep - GAIM for IM and OpenOffice.org for office applications. Theyll both already be installed.
    Kinda, yes, but it does take some effort. Youre better off trying GNU/Linux alternatives first imo.
    Any program released for GNU/Linux would work. Ones that are listen in Synaptic, or that have Ubuntu packages for download, will be alot easier to install than anything else.
    Do you know how to burn the ISO?

    Yes it can be run from disk, but then you cant save your settings/work. Theres an install program on the desktop that you can use to install it (the CD boots up to a full graphical Ubuntu desktop). Pay attention to the installation process so it doesnt delete Windows and then youll be able to dual-boot - it should be setup properly.
     
  7. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    Both Fedora Core and Ubuntu come with tons of software...free. Both installed Open Office automatically along with many other programs. Having installed both, I think FC has many more options available at install time. However, both allow you to easily d/l and install new software. That's one of the great things about Linux is there are many, many programs available.
     
  8. piratepenguin

    piratepenguin New Member

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    True, but Ubuntu is only one CD, which is god-damn impressive if you ask me.
     
  9. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    You know why that is don't you??

    It's because FC puts their d/l up front, so you d/l a bunch of stuff you wont use but you'll have it for the install if you do want to do an advanced install. However, with Ubuntu you just have to d/l the extra software programs. Either way you are still gonna have to d/l programs.

    Sure one could argue that the FC d/l is too bloated but having the install recognize all my hardware with very little help from me was quite impressive!
     
  10. piratepenguin

    piratepenguin New Member

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    I doubt many people install even one-CDs worth of programs onto Ubuntu after installing it.

    TBH, it was a fcking bitch for me to install FC5 - almost as big a bitch as installing Windows 2000. I was told I only needed the first CD, so thats what I downloaded and burned. When it came to selecting packages, I picked everything and assumed that when it finds a set of packages unavailable on the one CD that I have, itll be able to continue without them. Not so. It demanded the second CD. I had to reboot the thing back into Ubuntu (imagine if Id deleted it?), download and burn two more CDs and then I went to install just some of the packages. I was hoping Id have everything I needed - just the development stuff (which I really needed, to compile my wireless driver which isnt included in FC5 (I can excuse them for that.. its a beta driver, FC5 is old. But if it is not in FC6, there will be war)), and it asked for a fcking 4th CD!

    Eventually I got the 5 CDs together and installed everything, and Im liking it. Still havent gotten around to actually compiling my wireless driver, and then setting up my web-server and all that crap...

    I think 1 primary CD and 1 extras CD should really do the trick for any of these distros. The single-CD thing Ubuntu does does hold the project back (for example, they cant afford to ship any mono apps (of which there are many very nice ones - F-Spot, Beagle, Diva...)). I think soon enough Ubuntu may pretty much have to go 2-CD.

    5-CDs, though, can be frustrating for alot of people.
     
  11. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    Agreed...I thought 5 was a bit much also. I had a bunch of stuff to install with FC5 and it took every disk. That was crazy but I really like the install. Running different types of servers is a breeze and I like that I've got a GUI with my server.

    I know that most people wouldn't want a GUI with their server install but for a noob it's a really handy feature. Ubuntu's Server edition, in command line mode, just seemed like a throw back to a simpler time...like with dos. I know, I know....dos is nowhere near as powerful as Linux but that's not my point.
     
  12. dorkultra

    dorkultra OT's resident crohns dude OT Supporter

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    i like ubuntu. i haven't had much trouble at all with it on my pc. takes a bit longer to start up that windows though, but no big deal


    at school we have suse on our pcs that we use for voip class (have to run tftp server & asterisk). suse sucks bigtime if you are not logged in as root. whenever we disconnect from the college network, litterally yank the cord, it freezes the machines, unless you are logged in as root.
     
  13. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    Man, I had freezing issues with SuSE as well. I LOVED it, other than that. I prefer it to Ubuntu. But I had to zap the install because it kept freezing.
     
  14. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    Well I've been spending tonight getting familiar with Ubuntu and oh man...it's very nice. I launched the Rythmbox Music Player just to see what it looked like and saw a radio section. Clicked on it and saw 5 radio stations there! I've got the Ambient one playing in the background and holy shit...it's kick ass techno kinda music.

    I also spent time on the Ubuntu site. Wow, the community there is really cool...I've found all sorts of useful things to help me get more used to the OS. I'm still prolly gonna use my FC drive for server stuff, cuz I just like guis, but for a desktop OS, Ubuntu is very nice indeed.
     
  15. JordanClarkson

    JordanClarkson OT Supporter

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    That's why there's simplymepis which is kubuntu on 3 cd's :)
     
  16. piratepenguin

    piratepenguin New Member

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    Is this server the same computer as your desktop machine? I run plenty of servers on my desktop Ubuntu machine.. Just install Apache2, mysql, PHP, whatever you want, and youre basically good to go.

    As for the server edition of Ubuntu.. I bet plenty of people install X11 and some sorta window manager onto that, maybe a choice to have X11 w/ a window manager installed at install time wouldnt be a bad idea. I dont think it would help much though. Id probably just access my servers via SSH only anyhow. Its really well worth learning how to do stuff (everything) from the command line for that.
     
  17. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    Basically what I have is an older computer with removable HD trays so I can completly swap out HDs very easily (so I have a Linux HD a Windows Server HD and others) and both my main machine and this spare computer are behind my rounter on a home network.

    My goal with Linux was to recreate the main programming server we have at the University. You can connect to it through SSH or FTP and it has Oracle (I was gonna use MySQL) and compiliers for C++, Java, NASM and others. You can run PHP scripts on a different University server along with HTML and other web stuff. I wanted all that functionality at home but I'm not 100% confident in switching to Linux, especially considering some of the issues I've had in the past. So with my idea, I can play around with Linux all I want...even screw it up completly, and my main system isn't even affected.

    With FC, I was able to select each and every program I wanted to install at the time I installed it. With Ubuntu, it requires a little more work post installation but I'm starting to think that's a good thing....only install what you want/need. FC seems very bloated and once installed my system was somewhat sluggish (but it's prolly my fault cuz I installed sooo many different things).

    I definatly want to learn more about working with the command line. It's just that everytime I start I tend to get frustrated and overwhelmed by all the differences between a Dos/Windows environment and Linux. Seems like every problem I have in Linux takes some enormous efforts or lots of time to solve. I tend to get a bit discouraged after spending 2 hours researching a solution to a problem.....but it's getting better.
     
  18. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    If you're used to whatever commercial Unix your university used, why not download and try Solaris 10?
     
  19. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    Actually they use Linux. I'm not sure that we even have a Unix box available. The main research computer runs Linux but I dunno the distro.
     
  20. copeland

    copeland smarter than you

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    ok bringing the attention back on me...I played around with ubuntu...supa cool...gotta bunch of issues to work out apprently (sound...dual displays etc.) but I was just running it off disc.

    So what can you guys suggest as I install? I'm prepared to make it this machine a sole *nix box (screw xp/vista) I'm thinking all I need to do is backup everything off my C: (windows install) and just go dive head first into it.

    My system :

    amd 4200 x2
    Asus A8n deluxe
    2gb ram
    2x 320 WD hdd
    2x 120 WD hdd
    Asus 7800 gtx

    now my concern is my partitions

    C: windoez 29gb
    D: Program files (just game installs) 133gb
    E: Music 135gb
    F: apps/progs (stored) 135gb
    G: Downloads 136gb
    H: Media 112gb
    I: Images 112gb


    Now I can install ubuntu to the C: drive and wipe out xp but what does the "swap" partition do? and should I just install it on any drive? (I was thinking D since it's just installed games so if it wipes the whole partition no big deal)

    help me with setup please...
     
  21. piratepenguin

    piratepenguin New Member

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    Hmm.. Whats not working on the disk, I dont think will work when its installed. Well, not immediately anyhow. Dual displays you can definitely setup.

    What sound card do you have?
    For the swap partition, even 2Gb is overkill.

    The swap partition is used for "swapping out" memory from ram, so when ram is full, unused parts of it are moved to the hard-drive - the swap partition.

    In Windows, its swapped out to a swap file instead of a swap partition. (Linux can swap to a file too, but I dont know anyone who does that...)

    I always create a 1Gb swap partition and its never even half full. I think 15% is as high as Ive ever seen it. (since I added 512Mb+ more ram about a week ago (I used to only have 256Mb), I dont think the swap partitions been used at all)
     
  22. copeland

    copeland smarter than you

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    ok so I was screwing around more and just about to install then I see each ext needs it's own partition, so what is an efficient way to partition for install, what size partitions? I see swap needs 2 gb...

    what size partition for "/","/boot","/user","/nav" and whatever other extensions there were...

    I'm thinking I should use one of my 120 gb hard drives and partition:

    2gb to swap
    ??? to the rest?
     
  23. piratepenguin

    piratepenguin New Member

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    Setup the partitions at install time. I wouldnt setup so many. First of all theres no /user (its user) and /nav Ive never heard of.

    One for / and one for swap does the job. I always create a /stuff partition too, where all my music, vids, programming stuff etc is stored, and I share it between distros.
     
  24. JordanClarkson

    JordanClarkson OT Supporter

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    Are you running the AMD64 version? Go into system, preferences, sound and make sure it's selecting your mobo's sound card in ALSA mixer.

    As for partitions, it'll let you resize any partition when you install. Just defrag your drive in windows before you do it. The images drive looks good unless you really have that many images.
     

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