Just ordered some Audio Quest Type 4 speaker cable

Discussion in 'OT Technology' started by TenSteel, Jul 4, 2002.

  1. TenSteel

    TenSteel Ted Cruz suicide hotline OT Supporter

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    I've heard opinions from both sides of the fence as far as sound quality improvements with better wire. Stereophile calls this stuff the "best cheap [not really cheap, but inexpensive for premium wire] speaker cable on the market," so I thought I might try it. I'm skeptical, so I want to see if this really makes a noticeable improvement. We'll see how this $95 experiment goes ... I'll make sure to post the results after I do an a/b comparison with my Kef Q15.2 speakers.
     
  2. 04

    04 Guest

    Hehe, this will definatly be a good experiment. How do you plan to do the comparison? Do you actually think their will be a distinguishable difference? :)
     
  3. TenSteel

    TenSteel Ted Cruz suicide hotline OT Supporter

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    Right now I have Monster Cable MC500 (I think) 12 awg speaker wire hooked up to the Kefs. I'll listen to one or two songs on a CD that I'm familiar with, then switch the wires and see if there's a difference. I'm not biwiring the Kefs with the monster cable (even though I have enough) because I won't have enough of the AQ to biwire, so that way it'll be a fair comparison. I'll also do the empty source test (switch the receiver to Aux or something that's not hooked up, crank the volume, and see if there is more or less hiss and buzz) to test noise floors on each setup. I'll let you guys know the results as soon as I can. :)
     
  4. Nosamk

    Nosamk Guest

    I have AudioQuest type 6 biwire and noticed a significant difference over my old monster cable
     
  5. soul assassin

    soul assassin GTR eater

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    i also run the type 4 to my whole def tech set up and it sounds awesome!
     
  6. soul assassin

    soul assassin GTR eater

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    sounds a litlle bright though till you "burn em in" so be sure to put some hours on em before the test
     
  7. 04

    04 Guest

    :confused:

    I seriously do not understand how you can "burn in" a cable. It is nothing more than a run of copper wire in a plastic jacket. Or in the case of some high end wires RLC circuits. Are you running such high voltage through the wire that it physically changes the molecular structure of the copper?

    I could understand the "burn in" of speakers, as they do have suspensions that can be made more flexible from movement. But the break in of cables just makes no sense. The only thing I would imagine could happen is electron migration, which is a phenomenon that happens with computer cpu traces, but I cannot see why that would affect anything on such a large gauge cable that you would be using. Perhaps you are experiencing the placebo effect?
     
  8. 04

    04 Guest

    Paragon: have you done the test yet? If so, what did you find?
     
  9. TenSteel

    TenSteel Ted Cruz suicide hotline OT Supporter

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    Not yet. The cable should be here sometime tomorrow or the next day at the latest. Just checked my audio advisor account and it said the order was shipped.
     
  10. BobG

    BobG Fuchs.

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    I agree, sir. My god, now they're saying you have to "burn in" cables? LMAO. Probably the most rediculous thing I've heard.
     
  11. 04

    04 Guest

    Its quite frustrating that the general public can be so gullible. Many people claim to be able to tell the difference between cables, amplifiers, etc, claiming a dramatic difference between different types. Yet when given a blind test between the two under matched conditions, they cannot tell a difference, and guesses are limited to statistical probability.

    Its quite ironic that the people who dismiss all the expensive hype are the ones that actually have experience, while consumers are the ones claiming to hear the differences.

    How many EE's would argue the fact that burning in a cable would make a difference in sound? :rolleyes: I suppose if that is really true, computer data cables must be burnt in for extremly long times to ensure no data is lost in transmission. :rofl:
     
  12. 04

    04 Guest

    Re: I'm new, help :)

    Well, assuming there was no noise in your system to begin with, I doubt the new RCA's will make any difference. Those look like pretty nice RCAs though, visually they will be better of course. As for an improvement in sound, I would doubt it, but ya never know.

    FOr the speaker wire you will get no difference, I always run new speaker wire though anyways. Im afraid their is some factory device in line with the stock wiring that will crap up the speakers. Probably is not a difference though.
     
  13. TenSteel

    TenSteel Ted Cruz suicide hotline OT Supporter

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    Update

    I did the test last night. Here are my findings *puts on a flame suit for 042801's comments*:

    Ever since I ordered the speaker cable, I've been running the Kef's with standard wiring instead of biwiring so I could get used to the sound. Biwiring speakers does make a difference (I'm guessing it has something to do with the crossover), and I'd noticed a degredation in clarity ever since I changed it.

    I first did the noise floor test with each cable. The AQ noise floor was just a tiny bit quieter, probably because of the superior shielding.

    The songs I used for the test were both from the new Dream Theater album Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence : "Blind Faith" from disc 1 and "Losing Time / Grand Finale" from disc 2.

    I listened closely to each song through the monster cable first, in order to get a clear impression of the control group for the experiment. Then I switched the AQ cable, and immediately noticed the increased level of detail in the music: highs become more apparent, the midrange smoothed out, and the bass tightened up just slightly. There were also some subtlties in the songs I hadn't heard before. An example I can remember is hearing the bassist move down the fretboard before Petrucci (lead guitarist) leads in at roughly 0:30. As I listened further, I noticed that placement of the musicians on the soundstage became more defined, and that a certain depth to the music had been missing with the old monster cable. The monster cable soundstage was mushy by comparison, somewhat more difficult to notice the placement of musicians (especially when it came to placing certain instruments behind others). The clarity of this single run of AQ wire is superior than a double run (biwire) of the old monster cable. Quite an impressive improvement overall, definately a good bang for the buck. In all honesty, it's almost like I have a new pair of speakers. :bigthumb:

    I know that 042801 is going to cry "placebo" but I doubt that's the case because I had no expectations going into this experiment ... in fact, I was quite skeptical.

    Cliff notes: the AQ wire made a noticeable improvement, better than when I had monster cable biwired. A great bang for the buck improvement at $94. I also plan to upgrade my interconnects in the near future
     
  14. BobG

    BobG Fuchs.

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    I bet if you had a friend changing the wires for you so you didn't know what he/she was doing, your results would be MUCH different.

    That's usually the way I disprove the "SQ difference in wire" faith.
     
  15. 04

    04 Guest

    Paragon: Why would you need to put a flame suit on? If you really think you heard a difference, who cares what I say?

    However, I really dont think you did a good test. The reason is because you didnt pick the wire being used randomly. You put in the new wire and then compared. You really should have had a friend switching between the two, more than 10 times. If you could then pick out the wire every time, you would have a fair test, IMHO. You yourself said it was like new speakers. Also, I dont know what your speaker wire is made of, but unless it is wire only with no RLC networks, it will absolutely change the sound. A lot of high end cables have impedence compensation networks along with other electronic parts to audibly change the sound.

    What I still dont understand is why you posted about a month ago in this forum about how it is redicoulous how much people spend on cable. I believe you said over 100 dollars spent would be a waste. You spent around 100 on those cables, right? If you were to add 20K speaker cables to your system, do you think it would affect it more than the new wire?
     
  16. 04

    04 Guest

    Also, regarding the noise floor, that makes no sense. You said the new wire had better shielding. Speaker wire is not shielded. I cant think of any reason why it would be, other than it could be charged more money. Perhaps someone could educate me on this? :dunno: Sheilding in its literal term is only useful in RF frequencies, audio is too low in frequency. The signal is so strong in the speaker wire, I see no reason how interference could be picked up.
     
  17. 04

    04 Guest

    The other day I was listening to my stereo and noticed the bass was overpowering and had too much output at very low frequencies, around 30hz and below. So I thought to myself I should go and turn down the gain on the subwoofer amplifier. I glanced over and it hit me. The subwoofer amplifier, nor my equilizer was on. :ugh2: My speakers are pretty much fullrange and have decent output to 40hz. My subwoofer is equilized and crossed over around 40hz.

    That just goes to show you if you have something set in your head, you will probably believe it.
     
  18. TenSteel

    TenSteel Ted Cruz suicide hotline OT Supporter

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    When I said shielding, I was talking about the jacket around the wire. Should've said insulation :doh:.

    Anyways, what I posted about a month ago said $350 on wire, so even if I bought another 12 ft. run, I would still be under that budget. Interconnects later on will put me over the top of that budget, but it seems as if it will be worth it. And yes, I did say a month ago that it was senseless to spend lots of money on wire ... but that opinion was pretty much unfounded, so I wanted to see first hand if premium wire would make a difference. For my system, it did. :)
     
  19. 04

    04 Guest

    :ugh: Um dude, insulation would have nothing to do with rejecting noise either... Perhaps your new speaker cables have a RLC network? Is thier a box on the cable?

    I really wish you would try the test with a friend switching the cables without telling you. You would get such a better, unbiased test if you did it that way. I mean seriously if you can tell that much of a difference, it should be totally easy. Have him switch the wires back and forth 10 or more times and see if you can tell a difference each time. If the new wires really sound much better than the others, you should be able to easily distinguish the two. I know this might take some time, but I would really like to know. I honestly have not heard of one person actually trying that, except for Richard Clark's tests. I would really appriciate if you would do it. Thanks. :big grin:
     
  20. 04

    04 Guest

    Just a Q, Paragon, are you gonna try the blind test with a friend? Just wonderin! :bigthumb:
     
  21. TenSteel

    TenSteel Ted Cruz suicide hotline OT Supporter

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    Yeah, I'll do a blind test hopefully sometime during the coming week. As always, I'll keep you guys posted.
     
  22. BobG

    BobG Fuchs.

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  23. BobG

    BobG Fuchs.

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    Reading comprehension is key, sir. I read it and without documented test results it means nothing. Just cause a couple guys think they heard a difference doesn't mean anything. When you show me some documented experiment results in a controlled double blind comparison, then it might hold some water. You, unfortunately, haven't any.
     
  24. 04

    04 Guest

    What was the average rate of people hearing it correctly? My guess being as difficult as it was, the average person could only pick the right cable out around 5 times out of 10 in a two cable test.

    I cant find it. Its on Audiogon you say? Is there a forum on the website? All I saw were catagory listings for people selling products. At any rate, hearing a switch is quite impressive, that guy must have much better ears than I do...
     

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