Its getting be be new batteries time v.Diesel

Discussion in 'OT Driven' started by [DWI], Apr 18, 2008.

  1. [DWI]

    [DWI] Master of Nothing

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2000
    Messages:
    21,936
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Maine
    My Diesel Ram has got its OEM Batteries still in place, its an 03 with a July manufacture date. Anyways the batteries are starting to show all the signs of wearing out, longer crank times, more temperamental than normal when we had some nights in the 30's, sitting for longer periods of time makes seems to drain it, ect.

    For the next couple months I'll be running around Massachusetts and sometimes will be overnighting in places that are so remote that I'll be camping because there is no motel. I'd like to be able to run the stock radio or a power inverter with a laptop for a couple hours those nights without worrying about the truck not cranking over in the AM. The closest to offroading this truck comes is rough or partially washed out dirt roads. Most of the year she's daily driven in the city.

    Cliffs: I need new batteries for a 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel. Recommend me something, keep in mind there will be 2 of them.
     
  2. August Burns

    August Burns New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2004
    Messages:
    4,435
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Cook County
  3. P07r0457

    P07r0457 New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2004
    Messages:
    28,491
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Southern Oregon
    I would go with an optima redtop as the primary starter batt, and a optima yellowtop as the secondary batt.
     
  4. affende

    affende Resident 4X4 Elitest Prick

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2005
    Messages:
    6,948
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    in your balloon knot
    less than ideal to mismatch batteries on a dual battery system ...

    optima is hit and miss with the reds ... i have had one for 4 years and its perfect. hasnt even been bolted down for the last year so it gets tons of vibration and its still going strong ...

    more recent ones can be crap ...

    optimabatteries.com list, for your app, tons of batteries ....

    9002-002 is the red top 34 series ...

    "RedTop®; Battery; Group 34; Cold Crank Amps 800; Crank Amps 1000; Reserve Capacity 110; Ampere Hour 50; Top Terminal; L-10 in.; W-6 7/8 in.; H-7 13/16 in.; BOXED;"
     
  5. P07r0457

    P07r0457 New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2004
    Messages:
    28,491
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Southern Oregon
    Its always been recommended to me to use a redtop for your primary starter batt, and a deep cycle for your others.
     
  6. [DWI]

    [DWI] Master of Nothing

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2000
    Messages:
    21,936
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Maine
    they are wired in parallel, as far as the system is concerned they are just one battery with a longer lasting reserve. I'm not sure how most dual battery systems are wired, but that's how this one is setup and from the part of physics class dealing with batteries, it doesn't seem like a good idea to mix and match batteries.

    That's what I've heard, since someone else took over the production of Optimas the QC has gone down a good bit and gotten hit or miss like you said. To me Otimas seem a little overkill where there are other batteries with warranties up to 7 years. Is there really any other advantage to buying an optima other than its withstand loads of vibrations and it can mounted any direction?
     
  7. CastorTroy

    CastorTroy New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2005
    Messages:
    3,853
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Anytown, USA
    I'd go with either Duralast from Autozone or Wal-Marts brand. I've got two Duralast Gold's in my Diesel, and don't even have to plug it in overnight when the temp gets into the single digits, they crank way better than the OEM's. Optima's are good if you are going to be rock crawling or need to mount them upside down, other than that I'd avoid them, they don't seem to last as long as a regular high quality battery, and cost 3x as much.
     
  8. affende

    affende Resident 4X4 Elitest Prick

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2005
    Messages:
    6,948
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    in your balloon knot
    past that ... no, not really although for the load capacity, they can be smaller than a normal battery for your truck (assuming you have some big ass batteries like most diesels).

    the best thing about the optimas over the other batteries is its ability to be cycled time and time again and never flinch ... you can run them damn near dead, start your truck, and they charge like new ... assuming you dont get a dud.

    trends show that the bad QC problems (causing the batteries not to charge) are pretty much only affecting the red tops.

    if you think you need it, and you are really going to be cycling the batteries down low ... go with the yellow (deep cycle) or even teh blue top (marine / RV deep cycle ... HOSS DICK).

    also look into odyssey batteries ... though i have heard a few of them have had case leaks ... not nearly as much as the optima has had bad reviews.

    i would get as many opinions as possible and do some research and see what you think about everything.

    duralast is shit. just FYI. AZ and AAP both sell the same battery under different names (gasp) and the parts between the two and napa are all the same too ... different boxes and labels, same parts (gasp ... i have worked at all three).

    they are all shit. get a brand name battery (NOT DEKA!!) ... and honestly, if you do go with a AAP, AZ battery .... buy the best ones, you will need the warranty sooner or later.
     
  9. critter783

    critter783 OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2005
    Messages:
    1,785
    Likes Received:
    0
    Stick with two automotive batteries. You're not going to need a deep-cycle, period, but you will probably need all the cold cranking amps from the standard automotive batteries.
     
  10. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2005
    Messages:
    19,712
    Likes Received:
    0
    That depends on whether the batteries are electrically isolated from each other. It doesn't sound like they are.
     
  11. Pussysmith

    Pussysmith Banned

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2004
    Messages:
    429
    Likes Received:
    0
    Go to COSTCO and buy their generic brand. They are the premium line of battery made by Johnson Controls. Like everything else costco they are the best in the market at the lowest price. The ones for my vehicles were an easy$75 less than the Diehard alternative.

    Optimas are more for show unless you actually mount your batteries on their side. Do some research on Costco batteries, they are Kirkland Signature brand and are the highest rated AND cheapest batteries on the market.
     
  12. affende

    affende Resident 4X4 Elitest Prick

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2005
    Messages:
    6,948
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    in your balloon knot
    uhhhhh ... riiiiight.

    gel cell batteries have been proven time and time again, by many testings, to be more efficient, more resilient, and last longer than their liquid counterparts.

    seems like you are the one that needs to do more research.
     
  13. CastorTroy

    CastorTroy New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2005
    Messages:
    3,853
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Anytown, USA
    If you've done research on this, please provide your evidence supporting your asinine claims.
     
  14. affende

    affende Resident 4X4 Elitest Prick

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2005
    Messages:
    6,948
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    in your balloon knot
    asinine because its logical and proven???

    gel cell batteries resist vibration (biggest reason standard batteries fail prematurely) because the cell is supported on all sides by a semi rigid medium ...

    *** swim through gel, then swim through water ... which one provides more movement resistance??**

    the gel cells also do not suffer from sulfur precipitation (the second largest killer of batteries)

    **gasp ... top to killers covered***

    gel cell batteries, becoase of the design and orientation of the cells, allows for each of the six cells to be larger than a standard battery

    *** more CCA per volt/weight ***

    and when you flip, they dont cover you in nasty acid ...




    but you're right, those are asinine claims...



    and dont bring in cost, they do cost more, but they are better ... that would be like saying a honda is a better car than an audi ....
     
  15. Pussysmith

    Pussysmith Banned

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2004
    Messages:
    429
    Likes Received:
    0
    No.

    Your argument could be as correct as you want it to be and could be scientifically sounds (I don't care either way). However normal batteries last just fine.

    The Costco brand battery is the longest lasting and highest rated battery out there. It is also THE CHEAPEST battery and has the LONGEST FREE REPLACEMENT WARRANTY.

    Sure a "gel fancy cell" does crazy things, but there is no need for it when the normal battery works amazingly well as long as you mount it conventionally like this user is looking to do.
     
  16. PUREVIL

    PUREVIL More Money Than Brains Croo

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2001
    Messages:
    22,622
    Likes Received:
    14
    Location:
    Minot ND / Las Vegas NV
    I have a redtop in my NSX thats 7 years old and hasn't had a problem yet. My suburban has a yellow top for about 7 years too and NO problems. When I replace my batteries in my 05 Cummins I will get two yellow tops.
     
  17. affende

    affende Resident 4X4 Elitest Prick

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2005
    Messages:
    6,948
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    in your balloon knot
    the extra vibrations of a diesel CAN kill a battery prematurely, they idle low and they vibrate like hell, he has extra power drain and he plans on running the batteries low to dead .... a gel cell is a good move for someone like the OP.
     
  18. CastorTroy

    CastorTroy New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2005
    Messages:
    3,853
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Anytown, USA
    Proven by...?
    Indeed, gel cell's are more resistant to vibration, but this still doesn't equate to a longer lifespan, thus invalidating the whole point. Case in point, my lawnmower is a high vibration beast, and the cheap Wal-Mart (Exide?) car battery that runs it is 8 years old and still works great. What would a gel cell have offered me in this situation?
    Chemistry wise, a gel cell and wet cell are identical, neither offers a benefit over the other in regards to resistance/energy/etc.
    True, but how long will it take a wet cell to suffer too much electrolyte evaporation that it is rendered unusable? Can you offer some evidence that gel cell's last longer due to this?
    What is the benefit of this?
    Optima Red Top 910 CA battery -- 33.1 lbs, Duralast 875 CA battery -- 32.9 lbs. Same application, and group size of 75. A few more amps, but also heavier weight on the gel cell.
    I've never flipped a vehicle over, but I suppose there is some validity to this point. Though with a wet cell at 35% acid and the rest water, and only vents to allow it through, not much damage will be done. I'd really be more worried about being crushed or maimed worse than battery acid.
    Cost is a valid point, at two to three times the cost of a good wet cell, gel cells simply dont offer a compelling reason for purchase. I suppose if you plan on finding a reason to mount it on it's side, while vibrating it profusely before going Dukes of Hazzard and flipping your ride, it may be beneficial for you :)
     
  19. Brieldo

    Brieldo Bigger than you are.

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2003
    Messages:
    5,165
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    SEA, WA
    Honestly, I've seen more Optimas fail than some regular batteries. If I wanted the very best, I'd get an AGM battery from somebody like Odyssey. They offer extremely high resistance to vibration, temperature variations, and the high CCA necessary to crank over a diesel in the dead of winter. The Optimas I've had always seem to develop bad cells after a year and then the warranty is basically useless. The Interstate guy (Johnson Controls, who makes Optima, does their distribution through them...) wont even touch them after a year.

    Do yourself a favor and don't get an Optima. Also, compare a similarly group sized Optima to an Odyssey and tell me the weight difference...more lead = more power.
     
  20. deusexaethera

    deusexaethera OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2005
    Messages:
    19,712
    Likes Received:
    0
    My battery is made my Braille racing. It's an SLA battery, so I don't have to worry about acid coming out under any conditions. They also have rough-surface electrodes, so they can have smaller electrodes but still have the same surface area as larger electrodes. And Brieldo, it's not the amount of lead that affects amperage, it's the amount of exposed lead that affects amperage.

    They also make full-size, heavy-duty batteries, if you're interested.
     
  21. Brieldo

    Brieldo Bigger than you are.

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2003
    Messages:
    5,165
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    SEA, WA
    You're talking to an Electrical Engineer. I was merely making a generic statement to compare the heft of each battery. Odysseys are better in terms of their construction, output, and longevity...
     
  22. Brieldo

    Brieldo Bigger than you are.

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2003
    Messages:
    5,165
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    SEA, WA
    Also, here's some stats somebody threw up on another forum on Odyssey vs. Optima... Food for thought...

    Specifics:

    Warranty
    4 year full replacement vs. 1.5 year prorated

    8 psi bunsen valves vs. 1 psi...
    lower psi still vent while charging and this alone can contribute to failure as well as gassing

    pure virgin lead vs. recycled lead
    pure lead lasts longer


    lower resistance
    charges faster, puts out higher cranking amps, contributes to longer life

    more lead in the same physical size


    Optima grp 24 weighs 38 lbs (34M) and an Odyssey grp 24 weighs 55 lbs (1500T).
    Optima grp 31 weighs 59lbs D31M and an Odyssey grp 31 weighs 78lbs (2150)

    The warranty alone is worth it, in my opinion. No questions asked...new battery if yours pukes.
     

Share This Page