Discussion in 'Fitness & Nutrition' started by illmaticnyc, May 23, 2005.
what do you guys usually like to do?
I usually wake up around 8:30 and get to the gym for cardio at 9, first thing in the morning. I just prefer to get it out of the way early.
Cardio first thing in the morning does have benefits, but it's often confused with "cardio on a empty stomach".
The only thing I could think of is running would probably help wake me up.
1) For starters, after 8+ hours sleep your stomach isn't currently digesting anything.
2) Stimulating appetite in the morning vs. at night
Originally Posted by Lyle Mcdonald
My take on it is that, under most circumstances, it doesn't matter when you do cardio or what you burn.
The whole premise is basically that, to lose fat, you need to burn fat during the activity but this is (generally) flawed on a bunch of levels.
As others have pointed out (and I pointed out like 6 years ago in my first book), the body see saws fuels. If you use fat for fuel during activity, you will tend to use more carbs for fuel alter on; if you use carbs for fuel during activity, you tend to use fat for fuel later on.
A recent study demonstrated this clearly, after glycogen depletion from endurance activity, even in the face of a high carb intake, the muscle continued to use fatty acids (derived from fat stores) for fuel, storing the carbs as glycogen. So at the end of the day, it all pretty much balances out.
Study 1: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...4&dopt=Abstract
Other studies have shown that fatty acid release under fasted conditions far exceeds what you can burn off anyhow. So the fact that there are more fatty acids floating around may not make an ounce of difference.
Study 2: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...0&dopt=Abstract
Is available free online.
So even if you do cardio later in the day, you not only have fatty acids (in some proportion) floating around but you'll get an increase as soon as you start.
now, this is all predicated on being able to:
a. mobilize fatty acids effectively
b. oxidize them effectively
I mention this because there can be potential defects at each level. Extremely obese individuals, for example, tend to lose the capacity to readily oxidize fat for fuels during periods where they normally would.
In very lean individuals, fat mobilization (stubborn fat especially) could make some of the above assumptions incorrect. This would be especially true for women (men's ab fat generally isn't as stubborn as women's hip and thigh fat).
It's conceivable, that under those conditions, where fat mobilzation in the post-exercise state might impair fatty acid use and that morning cardio would be more effective. The whole caffeine thing fits right into this.
I actually should have pointed this out during the original thread: within a certain range (I'd guess maybe 15-40% bodyfat in men), none of this seems to make much of a difference (to be sure, any difference is small relative to the effort invested). At the extremes, goofy crap happens. Extreme obesity causes one set of problems, extreme leanness another. It's a fairly standard inverted U response curve.
So I'll concede that *maybe* some of these attention to detail matter at the extremes of leanness (problems in naturals really tend to kick in at the 12-15% bodyfat range and get worse as you get leaner) but even then most of fuel metabolism is being controlled by factors outside of our control. Then again, if we can modify it even by a small percentage amount, it might be worth it over extended periods. Still, that describes a fairly small minority of folks.
If I understood this correctly, the leaner you are (under 10%) then it would make a difference? Otherwise at higher bodyfat levels, you're just being anal?
Well it is best for fat burning as long as you don't eat. Not eating for 8 hours+ because of sleeping and then wake up and do cardio = Most amount of fat burn.
This is one theory, based on the idea that during and post-cardio, your body will (in theory) utilize fat storage for energy. In this scenario, I would still get a small solid food meal (especially protein) immediately prior to cardio.
Also, many people report that they are less likely to puke during morning cardio (PARTIALLY empty stomach).
Looks like only 15% (HIIT AM and PM anyone ?)
No... but definately a good start.... consider regular rolled oats in that scenario
Longterm goals ?
Shortterm goals ?
My take on it is this. If you haven't eaten in eight hours and do cardio, you are going to burn more fat because of low glycogen levels. However, when you eat later in the day you will store more fat because you are not utilizing the glycogen for energy like you would if you ran later in the day. Cardio has little effect on EPOC, so it is six of one, half dozen of the other.
This is basically what I am trying to say in a more complicated fashion.
bumping for the tard that couldn't seem to search for this