I read a cool quote the other day.. that I'm going to mess up here

Discussion in 'Vaginarium' started by Falconer, Oct 5, 2009.

  1. Falconer

    Falconer OT Supporter

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    I'll paraphrase this but you'll get the point. It was on values and self-worth and mate-seeking:

    "Someone who is rich, creative, or attractive, might end up marrying someone else who isn't as rich, or as creative, or as attractive, but someone of high integrity will never marry someone who isn't of equally high integrity."

    It was from a book on upper class (socioeconomic class) dating.


    I thought it was a good quote (maybe I'll go look up the actual quote later) but basically it opened my eyes in a similar way to how MM and RSD opened my eyes, by allowing me to intellectualize and define things that I had only picked up on subconsciously before.

    It's another piece of the social puzzle for me. The reason I don't have many close friends is because of differences in integrity. I always just got weird vibes from many people before, like hypothetically I wouldn't trust them to do the honest thing in certain situations, but it was just a vibe. Now, after reading that quote, I understand better how I was feeling about them.
     
  2. HuskiRuski

    HuskiRuski Cardinal Fan

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    what percentage of your day do you spend analyzing your life/actions?
    not flaming.
     
  3. Falconer

    Falconer OT Supporter

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    not so much recently
     
  4. Deborah

    Deborah Seeing is believing, but I don't want to know.

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    I don't believe in that quote. People can marry whoever they want if they make each others happy and it is absolutely no one's business to judge them for this. I'm tired of stupid people in this society that let themselves judge others based on the fact that their SO is not as attractive, smart or whatever as they are. Seriously I know guys that have all the features that society loves but I don't feel anything with them and am just like blah.

    EDIT: oops, I think I read the quote in a wrong way!
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2009
  5. Falconer

    Falconer OT Supporter

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    I was gonna say...
     
  6. JBunni

    JBunni New Member

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    That makes a lot of sense to me. Even in friendships, I can see this being true. Definitely shines some light into my life.
     
  7. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    There are exceptions to every rule and once you define a rule, you can find exceptions if you look for them. Most people don't....they agree with the rule and believe in it's "truth" and what they perceive matches the rule. When we give up belief in the rule, we then start to perceive all sorts of exceptions.

    Rules are easy to remember and seem to hold value and bring order to chaos and IMO that's the appeal to a great number of people. However, they may also close us off to deeper lessons, truths and meanings in life.

    Will someone marry below their integrity level? Of course. Why? Because chemistry trumps logic. Another reason? Because they believe what matters is not where you are but rather where you are heading. So if someone of lesser integrity is trying to change, this may be very appealing to the other.

    Rules are made to be broken. :) Less rules, more acceptance.
     
  8. Falconer

    Falconer OT Supporter

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    Obviously there can be chemistry that trumps everything at first, but over time the other person's lack of integrity will show itself and be a factor in the relationship ending. In fact, the book I read that in even gave examples of exactly that thing happening.

    I don't think integrity is something you change, tho. It's kind of like the root of who you are.
     
  9. ForgottenSpiral

    ForgottenSpiral Hope and Irony OT Supporter

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    What do you mean by integrity?
     
  10. themolsen

    themolsen New Member

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    I agree more so with Facloner, but I agree a bit with Coottie too. Of course there are exceptions to every rule. But overall, I believe integrity is an area in which there must be ABSOLUTE agreement and compatibility for a successful LTR and ultimately marriage.

    When I look back on past and current relationships and friendships, this becomes very apparent.
     
  11. themolsen

    themolsen New Member

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  12. ForgottenSpiral

    ForgottenSpiral Hope and Irony OT Supporter

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    I disagree wholeheartedly. That statement is too broad to even potentially fit into the realm of possibility. I have seen people of "high integrity" marry those without "high integrity".
     
  13. themolsen

    themolsen New Member

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    I guess the question is is that a compatible situation...will it last? And people often perceive their own integrity different from what it actually is.

    And I guess everyone values different aspects differently...so for some, maybe integrity isn't as big a piece of the pie as it is in my mind. For me, integrity is at the absolute top of what's important in a relationship. If someone doesn't measure up to my perceived integrity, I feel there's a huge lack of compatibility
     
  14. Vysion

    Vysion New Member

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    I see Falconer is back to his normal self :)
     
  15. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    Oh I totally disagree with that.

    If we define integrity as, "What you do when noone else is watching" which is a practical definition that I think works very well, then one can easily adjust their behavior based on negative consequences for bad behavior.

    Here's the defn from Wiki, "Integrity is consistency of actions, values, methods, measures, principles, expectations and outcome." Since consistency is in there, the same thing applies. Want to change your integrity, simply start consistently acting in a manner that is "better" than you did previously.
     
  16. JBunni

    JBunni New Member

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    True people can change, but as a rule, the generally dont. If they do want to change its something they have to work very hard at. When it comes to marriage, I dont think you would want to be with someone one a different integrity level, or someone who was in the process of changing. Choosing someone on the same level would help with compatibility and harmony in the relationship.
     
  17. Nullius

    Nullius New Member

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    I can see it going either way, you're attracted to who you're attracted to for whatever reason.

    I see people cheating on their spouses all the time. Complete lack of integrity is involved in those decisions.
     
  18. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    Perhaps it's just me but I believe people change through out their lives. I've worked very hard to change my life in so many ways that I'm hardly the same person that I was in my 20s and yet, I am the same.

    So let's discuss more specifics. If I'm a liar most of the time and let's be honest here, we all lie, every single one of us does it....but I'm talking about someone who lies when it would actually be easier to just tell the truth. They may lie for many years of their life and it bugs them but they just keep stuffing it way down deep. Over time, after they've experienced many years of people leaving them, lying to them, etc.....they finally decide it's just not working anymore and decide to change.

    Tolerance for pain may be high but it is not without limit. Everyone eventually says something like, "There has got to be a better way" and it's at that moment that they begin to change. When they finally get to this point, they can make massive and sweeping changes in their lives.

    I do admit that I want to believe this. I need to believe this about people because it does a number of things for me. It provides me with hope and keeps me from becoming a cynical prick. I also need to believe that I can change my life and that's something that keeps me going through difficult times. Perhaps I'm delusional but I don't think so......I've seen too many people make some very dramatic changes in their lives.
     
  19. Coottie

    Coottie BOOMER......SOONER OT Supporter

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    One of my very best friends in the whole world cheated regularly on his wife. He used to say, "One of the best things about guilt is that it goes away." This guy slept with many, many married women and used to name some of them. I couldn't believe it until I saw him with these women. These were rich and very prominent women in the community.

    He used to tell me that the vast majority of them didn't want to cheat but they were miserable in their marriages and needed the excitement. They would pine to him about leaving their husbands and settling down for real.

    This guy divorced his wife and married a new woman, one he really wanted to commit to. We don't talk much these days but last we talked, he was still faithful to her some 10 years into their marriage. Yes he could have been lying to me but I don't think so....I know him quite well.

    He claimed that he was enjoying being committed to one woman and that he was glad his cheating days were behind him. He said his cheating had more to do with being miserable and trapped in a loveless marriage than anything else. Once he committed to changing what was wrong in his life, he didn't need to cheat on his wife anymore but the damage was done with the first one so he moved on to a new one.
     
  20. JBunni

    JBunni New Member

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    Like I said, people CAN change, but it is difficult. It can take years for some one to get sick of their habits and want to change. I'm saying waiting for someone to change, or even thinking you can change them, is not wise. A lot of people use the excuse, 'this is how I am', or 'this is how I was raised' to not change. They either like who they are (even if others dont) or they are too lazy to make the changes. Even when some people try to change, they fall back into old habits. If two people are on different integrity levels going into a marriage, its possible for one to change and them to work it how. However, its not likely and not a good idea to enter into a marriage that you see that difference/ lack of integrity from you potential husband/wife.
     
  21. Falconer

    Falconer OT Supporter

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    most people don't change.

    and if they do, it's often temporary.
     
  22. themolsen

    themolsen New Member

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    I think there's a distinction to be made between change and growth. Many people change as they grow and stay that way. And others grow because they've changed and stay that way.

    I think just pure change without some sort of corresponding growth is temporary.

    I think growth is actually integrating changes into yourself and making them part of who you are. Just MAKING or EXHIBITING a change doesn't necessarily mean YOU'VE changed. Make any sense?
     
  23. jonno

    jonno New Member

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