i briefly heard some aerial acoustics model 9s the other day

Discussion in 'OT Technology' started by Ronin, Jan 20, 2007.

  1. Ronin

    Ronin Guest

    went into my shop to pick up some stands for my rears and while my sales guy was in the back i wandered into the aerial room where the fifth element was playing

    http://www.aerialacoustics.com/html/prods.html

    the 9s were hooked up to some mark levinson mono amps i beleve and some other stuff i dont remember

    they were playing the fifth element and the sound stage on those were pretty killer, too bad they cost such a butt load though , they sounded really effortless-ish 2

    lolz when u google: >aerial acoustics model 9< the first link that shows up is my stereo shops web site

    PS: do you think you could DIY something better than those 8k speakers?
     
  2. twistid

    twistid Banged By Super Models Moderator

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    i've always felt that once you cross over the $2k range, you're buying a name... a badge for elitism, and blindfolded... most people could not tell you the difference between a $2k speaker, and a $8k speaker... it's all about appearance, and majesty... shock and awe, when you get into that level.
     
  3. emorphien

    emorphien New Member

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    Admittedly probably not my first choice for home theater, but I loved loved loved the Aerial 9 for music. Funny though, I had the exact opposite reaction when I heard the 20T, almost like it was too perfect and flat, and it was really unengaging for me personally when I listened to it. I'd like to give them another chance though sometime.
     
  4. Harry V. Gina

    Harry V. Gina How did your family do in Katrina?

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    I never seen a post in this forum that I agree with less. You don't think that just about anyone could tell the difference between a pair of Klipsch floorstanders and a pair of , say, Dynaudio Evidence?
     
  5. ngsm13

    ngsm13 New Member

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    Yeah, no shit.
     
  6. emorphien

    emorphien New Member

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    ahem... well. If people don't know what to listen for, as prices increase it takes considerably more money to make bigger changes and I would imagine that for most of the inexperienced public, it isn't easy for them to tell the difference between $2k and $8k. But it will depend heavily on the speakers chosen, and even then... yeah I'd say a lot of people would have trouble without learning the kinds of things people usually listen for. Even then it's tricky because if you start telling them what to listen for you can end up inadvertently suggesting them to respond in a certain way.

    Now, take people who know what they're doing and know how and what to listen for and they'll pick up on any differences much more readily.
     
  7. twistid

    twistid Banged By Super Models Moderator

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    i guess you missed the "most people" part... and yes, there are many people who could not tell you the difference when blindfolded.
     
  8. Ronin

    Ronin Guest

    all i know is that sound of these 8k speakers was definately different than my 2500 dollar ones, then again my room still needs about 2k worth of acoustical treatments to make it more fair (probably more than that as im sure their listening room is also highly dampened)

    the scene that was playing was the blue lady singing in the opera hosue
     
  9. twistid

    twistid Banged By Super Models Moderator

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    so what you are saying is... you are the only thing that's the same, when comparing both speakers???
     
  10. Ronin

    Ronin Guest

    pretty much. ive listened to other stuff in their listening rooms before 2 though, the aerials are still different, its hard to explain.
     
  11. TFunkadelic

    TFunkadelic One Nation Under A Groove

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    I think I could build something better than the 9's, if given the right tools and materials and a good chunk of time. I've seen people build much more complex/elaborate things in their garages. There aren't too many speakers that are outside the realm of an experienced wood worker and a good shop, except for super exotic speakers like the nautilus.
     
  12. Harry V. Gina

    Harry V. Gina How did your family do in Katrina?

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    So are you saying that you could build something that looks like the 9's or sounds like them? There are a kot of talented DIY speaker builders out there, but they probably spend a lot more than $9k in trial and error before they get something that sounds as good as an Aerial.
     
  13. Ronin

    Ronin Guest

    so in the realm of super exotic its almost worth the cost of speakers?
     
  14. TFunkadelic

    TFunkadelic One Nation Under A Groove

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    If you already have the machinery (and I know quite a few people who have pretty well equipped work shops), then no, not at all. $9,000 is ALOT of money to spend on raw materials. people have made/designed speakers that, on paper, should be superior to the 9's. I personally have built Proac Response 2.5 speakers (retail price $4,500) and they actually sound better than the original models. The only way to replicate the aerials would be to get a hold of one, take it apart and copy the crossover schematic/enclosure bracing, and that's what happened with the response 2.5. Now you might not be able to build something similar to the 9, just because it wouldn't make sense to buy a pair just to replicate, but there are other speaker designs availible online that are really quite remarkable, and in terms of design, are much more advanced.

    Oh, and for reference....Upgraded parts included (better inductors, capacitors, things like that), the response cost me about $800 to build...$3700 less than the retail model...Retail speakers don't defy physics or anything. They're still just speakers. They've had the benefit of excellent engineering, but there are plenty of designs on the web or otherwise that have been extensively tested/tweaked to perform amazingly.
     
  15. emorphien

    emorphien New Member

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    It cost you $800 to build, but how much time did you spend on it and how much did your equipment cost?

    All that has to factor in to it, particularly for people to new to DIY. When I'm out of grad school, have a steady job and a house, I'd like to play with DIY but until that time my capabilities are extremely limited, as is my time. I also value my time highly, so paying potentially hundreds or thousands more than just the raw materials might pay off for some it were going to take a person six months or a year to build given their circumstances, for example. Even if you can borrow the equipment, the rest is costly in either hidden costs or your own personal time.

    That's an exaggeration of course, but I have noticed on many audio forums that the DIY fans (I have nothing against DIY, I just can't do it right now) seem to fail to realize the cost of equipment, design, time and of course the expenses incurred in errors, particularly for the first DIY speaker attempt.
     
  16. TFunkadelic

    TFunkadelic One Nation Under A Groove

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    ummm, yeah, that's why it's cheaper..because you do it yourself...You are essentially paying yourself (or not paying someone else, rather) to put the pieces together.

    If you read my post I mentioned that if you ALREADY HAVE THE EQUIPMENT it is the way to go. I never tried to hide that. It's actually in the very first line because someone had already asked that same question.

    I was fortunate enough to have acess to my schools wood shop which had everything I needed for the job.

    And even if you want to factor in the cost of manufacturing equipment, it's easier to argue for the DIY route when the speakers in question are as expensive as the aerial 9's. Building speakers, especially basic boxes really doesn't require many tools at all. A good table saw, power drill, plunge router, and sander of some type is all you really need. With a $1,000 budget for tools, you can get everything you need (and that's buying decent tools). That leaves you with another $7,000 to spend on parts, and there is no way in hell those speakers are $7,000 in raw parts or aerial wouldn't be making any money. Being very generous, there are at most $4,000 worth of parts in those speakers, probably significantly less (but I'm being conservative for the sake of argument).

    Assuming aerial is only charging double the cost of parts, which is extremely unlikely, you're saving $3,000, which to me is plenty of justification, especially if you have any kind of confidence in woodworking at all.



    Upon inspection, I've noticed that the model 9's list price is actually $8800 for the cheapest finish, and that doesn't do anything to dissuade me from the DIY route.
     
  17. emorphien

    emorphien New Member

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    And that's what I was saying, in case you missed it. It's time consuming, particularly if you don't have much skill at it. Some people would rather pay someone else than spend their own time doing it. How much the end "cost" differs can be negligible in certain circumstances.

    I'd agree though, that if someone has some experience and they were considering some very expensive conventionally designed speakers, that buying the equipment and doing it DIY would probably be less in terms of $$ spend on parts, materials and tools. Nevermind the fact that you'd then be out a fair bit of time in actually building them.
     
  18. TFunkadelic

    TFunkadelic One Nation Under A Groove

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    I didn't miss it, you missed it, again. Read the 2nd line of my last post.

    As far as the personal time goes that everyone thinks is so huge...an hour a day in your garage and you've got new speakers in a month (or easily much less depending on your skills). Most people who post on this forum have that kind of time, and many of them a whole lot more.
     
  19. TFunkadelic

    TFunkadelic One Nation Under A Groove

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    Also, if you want to talk about time put in on building speakers, you could probably build them faster than the time it would take you to earn the money working a normal job to pay the difference on the retail cost.
     
  20. Ronin

    Ronin Guest

    what i was getting at was wouldnt it be hard to gain access to high end drivers?

    (if you can get these high end drivers where would i find them?)

    i think you're going to a hit a point where you just cant go out and buy drivers that will match whatever is used in the exotic loudspeakers.

    like dynaudio evidence series, wilson audio, etc

    i think at a point its going to take someone with a lot of skill and abilties to go and just make a high-end speaker especially if asthetics are important especially if you are going to try and build something to compete in more exotic level markets

    referring to the above parenthese'd text: if you wanted to build something that was so good it made everyone in the room blow their load and you normally could afford exotic or near exotic where would you have to go to get drivers?
     
  21. TFunkadelic

    TFunkadelic One Nation Under A Groove

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    Obviously, there is a point where the big companies can have custom drivers manufactured that a DIY'er can't compete with. But, it is definitely possible to build something that competes with the bulk of high end speakers, and the model 9 performance should be attainable with the right design. I know I sound like a proac fanboy, but the fact that those speakers can be built, and are considered by many to be some of the best sounding speakers under $10,000, is testament to that fact. I know I haven't heard anything in their price range that has made me second guess them. And the proacs aren't even a complex design. They just had some great thought put in to them as far as driver balance/tuning frequency.


    In answer to your question though, madisound.com has quite a few pretty high end drivers, many of which are used by companies like Vienna Acoustics, Proac. Partsexpress has quite a few as well. I think you're over estimating the parts cost of high end speaker companies. http://www.madisound.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi?cart_id=1831482.4126&pid=1167 I've seen these drivers in +$10,000 speakers, and they're not even scan speaks top of the line woofers.
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2007
  22. Ronin

    Ronin Guest

    thats probably the ugliest looking speaker ive ever seen, lol, not saying its not worth the money but it is pretty grotesque :mamoru:

    on another note: this is coolest fucking tweeter ive ever seen: http://www.madisound.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi?cart_id=1831482.4126&pid=1920

    :eek5:
     
  23. Arc

    Arc New Member

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    The MBQ dome midrange I have in my car used to be in a $10.000 tower a couple years ago, so I have read. There are high end drivers that you can buy pretty easily you just need to know where.
     
  24. TFunkadelic

    TFunkadelic One Nation Under A Groove

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    They look pretty cool in person actually, not nearly as ugly as that picture makes them out to be. When you see them in a speaker they actually look really exotic/shnazy. Here they are in the vienna acoustics mahler.

    [​IMG]


    BTW, those tweeters you just posted used to be used in the high end speakers from meadowlark audio.
     
  25. Harry V. Gina

    Harry V. Gina How did your family do in Katrina?

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    That looks like the tweeter used in the Magico Mini.

    http://www.sonicflare.com/archives/vegas07-biggest-hype-magico.php

    http://www.magico.net

    With the exception of a couple of firms such as Dynaudio and Focal, a lot of the drivers used in high-end speakers are available to the public.
     

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