Falconer's LTR theory v.why "the list" is important

Discussion in 'Vaginarium' started by Falconer, Jan 22, 2008.

  1. Falconer

    Falconer OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2006
    Messages:
    65,506
    Likes Received:
    1
    Sorry this isn't as brilliantly well-written as most of my stuff :mamoru: I'm tired and I'm at work, but you'll get the general idea.

    While you are single (and therefore uninhibited by the emotions of love) establish what you want in an LTR partner. Actually put some thought into it; don't just come up with random stuff.

    Use this list (which may actually be written out or just kept in your head) as a filter for potential partners. Do not stray too much from the criteria you have established in your list. This is important, because the chemicals released during the initial stages of love (first 1-6 months or so) cause you to be less critical of other people's shortcomings. In other words, what might not objectively pass your criteria on paper suddenly becomes "ok" because you are operating in a different state of mind (for example, "well, it sucks that this girl doesn't like to give head/sucks with money/whatever, but it's ok... I'm still totally attracted to her...") However, this state will end eventually, and these traits in your SO that you have allowed to slide will slowly but surely build resentment (something that would have been avoided altogether had you stuck to your initial filtering criteria). Now you're in an LTR with someone who you resent and might cheat on because you love getting head and she doesn't like to give head, or who has no marriage potential because she sucks with money and will cause you to go bankrupt, etc.

    If you find someone who meets your criteria, however, then once the honeymoon phase ends, your attraction to them will not drop because they will still objectively fulfill your needs.
     
  2. FloppyCock

    FloppyCock New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2001
    Messages:
    5,630
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    California
    Sounds like a great way to avoid having fun in order to spare yourself the trouble of breaking up somewhere down the line.
     
  3. antihero

    antihero OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2002
    Messages:
    14,236
    Likes Received:
    10
    Location:
    NYC
    so hows your relationship going?
     
  4. Falconer

    Falconer OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2006
    Messages:
    65,506
    Likes Received:
    1
    Awesome (knock on wood).
     
  5. Falconer

    Falconer OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2006
    Messages:
    65,506
    Likes Received:
    1
    If you're not interested in establishing an LTR then this doesn't really apply to you. And it's not to avoid "breaking up" as much as it is to avoid "wasting time." But someone wanting to just have fun wouldn't be interested in long term compatibility, anyway.
     
  6. FloppyCock

    FloppyCock New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2001
    Messages:
    5,630
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    California
    What do you consider an "LTR?" Six months? One year? Marriage? If I go into your original post and change "LTR" to marriage, this would read like something one woman would say to another, and even then I'd disagree with it.

    I just don't get the mindset of a relationship as a race, where you need to avoid "wasting time" so you can get to the "LTR" at the finish line.
     
  7. Falconer

    Falconer OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2006
    Messages:
    65,506
    Likes Received:
    1
    LTR meaning someone who is interested in establishing a long term, monogamous relationship. So not random hookups, multiple sex partners, etc.

    It's not that at all. It's just, if your goal is a LTR, you don't want to waste time dating people with whom you aren't compatible. But people don't seem to understand this.
     
  8. FloppyCock

    FloppyCock New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2001
    Messages:
    5,630
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    California
    If you are in a fulfilling relationship for a year with a girl, and in the end you break up, have you wasted your time?
     
  9. DTR rex

    DTR rex New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2004
    Messages:
    14,518
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Chi-Town
    I've had an idea of what I look for/expect from a girl in an LTR for quite a while now.... It's just hard to find.
    I have started to tell myself that what I want is not possible, for it puts too much faith in the idea of perfection but I am slowly learning that the little stuff can be overlooked and attention on the larger aspects of that "list" are what is really important.

    The problem with having a written "list" is that every girl you meet will be scrutinized in accordance to meeting the standards of this list and often you will become so obsessed with judging every girl you meet that you realize you're just not having any fun anymore.
     
  10. chlywly

    chlywly Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2000
    Messages:
    18,745
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Toronto
    Having a very good idea of what you are looking for in a potential partner, IS one of the most important prerequisites of a 'potentially' successful relationship. Should go without saying..........
     
  11. Pringles

    Pringles New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2005
    Messages:
    4,692
    Likes Received:
    0
    I hate to be an ass, but don't you like to live a little? Make some mistakes? Be spontaneous and take chances? I do and this list definitely turns my life more into a machine rather than a person.

    People need to learn when a relationship is going bad and leave it.
     
  12. Falconer

    Falconer OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2006
    Messages:
    65,506
    Likes Received:
    1
    Girls do that to guys constantly.
     
  13. demosnat

    demosnat New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2006
    Messages:
    4,994
    Likes Received:
    0
    Keep in mind that when you meet a new girl your brain runs a shit ton of checks on her immune system (smell) suitability for breeding (hips, figure in general, if she has even features, ) and general health (condition of hair, teeth, skin and nails)
    I try to rely on that as a solid basis.

    It is important to have criteria, things that you KNOW will cause problems if you're marriage/serious LTR minded. But, I do enjoy having new things in my life, especially things I never knew I would enjoy.

    For instance: 'must be either an atheist or (preferably) believe in (a) god(s) but not be a member of any religious group.'
    I started dating a seriously religious person, and although the issues that I knew would come up have indeed arisen, i've actually really enjoyed it and felt that we've both grown from it. I now prefer dating non-atheists.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2008
  14. demosnat

    demosnat New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2006
    Messages:
    4,994
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think I will always maintain a few such as
    "must want children"
    "must have good relationship with mother and sisters" (barring extreme circumstances) and
    "must have some general idea of what they want to do with their life, or be in college in a not half assed way."
     
  15. f00l

    f00l Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2004
    Messages:
    25,582
    Likes Received:
    4
    wat?
     
  16. demosnat

    demosnat New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2006
    Messages:
    4,994
    Likes Received:
    0
    Two primary types of college students I know

    Type 1. "I'm a (fresh/sophomore/junior/senior) majoring in X. I will be graduating in MMYY and plan to (insert job) right away or attend (selection of grad schools) to study (major) and eventually do something in the (insert field) field, also, I have had this major/life plan for more than 20 minutes."

    This type, I will date, and I prefer above any other sort of partner. They understand i'm busy sometimes, and that during finals week they will not see me. They also understand that at a point in time very soon I will be moving for law school.

    Type 2. "I kind of major in philosophy, or english, but I can't bring myself to take anything above a 400 level course. I might graduate in the next two or three years, I don't know. I'm not sure what I want to do IF I graduate, maybe get a job? Grad school would be cool, I wonder what you have to do to get into that? PS i've dropped out of school 11 times. Good thing moms paying for this shit"

    Not dating that guy.
     
  17. f00l

    f00l Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2004
    Messages:
    25,582
    Likes Received:
    4
    oh OK I thought you meant you judge them by their major
     
  18. demosnat

    demosnat New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2006
    Messages:
    4,994
    Likes Received:
    0
    You can tell all sorts of things from what a person finds compelling enough to study, but I can't think of a major that I wouldn't date on the grounds of that being their major, i'll get back to you on that one.
     
  19. f00l

    f00l Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2004
    Messages:
    25,582
    Likes Received:
    4
    but i agree with what you said though

    I find the type 2 tend to be the rich girls or the girls that want to find a rich guy to marry and be a house wife
     
  20. demosnat

    demosnat New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2006
    Messages:
    4,994
    Likes Received:
    0
    I've dated guys like that. Rich little boys who don't really get that their parents upper middle class income won't support them forever, and they're not quite trust fund babies.

    I'm looking through majors at my uni right now to see if there is a major I wouldn't date. I would be wary of philosophy majors unless they were really far into it, people take communications, philosophy and english looking for an easy way through school
     
  21. iwishyouwerebeer

    iwishyouwerebeer you shut your cunt Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2006
    Messages:
    32,592
    Likes Received:
    5
    :werd: I read this and understand why he's been "in love" 4 times in his 4 long LTR's. Shit, I'm so glad I've had fun all along the way casually dating and learning more and more about different men, their quirks, and how they work. Not just setting up a list of what I think I want in a partner and sticking by it, casting aside people who don't fit.
     
  22. Viper

    Viper OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2004
    Messages:
    65,773
    Likes Received:
    518
    Location:
    In a van down by the river
    I think people need the list. I agree with you Falc.

    BUT if the girl doesn't meet your criteria, you don't immediately need to "chuck" her. You just need to realize that it's not going anywhere so that you are not surprised when those honeymoon feelings wear off.
     
  23. Amanda Ann

    Amanda Ann New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2007
    Messages:
    14,024
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    FL

    Gosh, I hate to say it, but I agree.

    I have some standards that I'm pretty picky (education, job) about, and some less important that I'm willing to let go (sense of style), and I feel that's really let me avoid alot of potential drama filled dead end relationships. I don't know, maybe for me it's that i don't have time to eat three meals a day, 5 times a week, let alone play silly mind games and the never ending circle of "Let's try to change my SO".. :ugh:
     
  24. ww_Crimson

    ww_Crimson New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2007
    Messages:
    21,652
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Bay Area
    While I believe having a list of 'criteria' is definitely a good thing to do, it isn't something to live or die by.

    I remember reading your very thorough list a while back (Falconer) and although most of the things on it I agree(d) with, I found it to be a bit overkill. There are a lot of small quirks a woman might have that can easily be adjusted to.

    The most important thing to do is define some of the key qualities that you find important, such as education, intelligence, sense of humor, level of responsibility, maturity, etc. etc. After you have these key traits set aside, its important to simply be honest in your communication with your partner. If you find that she doesn't like giving head and that is important to you, it's something you need to talk about. Maybe she had a bad experience with it and all it would take is a conversation and some time to change things.

    I believe the worst thing to do is identify a trait your significant other has that you don't like, but wait to tell them about it. Being upfront and straight forward will get you to where you want to be very quickly. Chances are you won't have wasted too much time in your "LTR" search, and you won't have been so picky that you'll have trouble finding a girl in the first place.

    My .02
     
  25. JohnJohnJohnson

    JohnJohnJohnson Effetely Sipping My Latte OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    23,006
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Manhattan
    :werd:

    Falconer, what are your thoughts on this hypothetical?

    Of course none of this would be a problem if you didn't do the monogamy by default thing. Right now, you start off with the assumption that you have to be with only one person at one time - one person to provide you with all the affection and physical intimacy and emotional crack in your life. Based on that assumption, a list like this could make sense: when you're using this assumption and you are considering being with someone, what you are actually considering is being LOCKED IN with this one person as your sole source of romantic solace.

    I don't think that assumption is true though.

    The alternative would be to do exactly what you feel.

    Rather than constantly planning to set up the perfect emotional support, I prefer doing what feels right at every given moment. Theoretically if I do that all the time, I'll always feel right. As opposed to if I wait to set up the perfect feeling. Then I've spent most of my time waiting.

    Also, you have a false presumption in there somewhere. Some people DO in fact get in relationships where they fall in love over and over again. Those first 6 months are mirrored until death. In these rare cases, the "honeymoon" phase isn't a phase. I've heard of it here, anecdotally. Also, Time magazine printed one of its retarded articles on romance recently where some scientists said that "somehow" people really seemed to be feeling these things "even" after all that time together.

    The fashion these days is to, first, assume that the passion will diminish, and second, plan for that contingency, with contractual agreements and some kind of rational approach.

    Think about all the shit that the PUA community realized people were taking for granted, but turned out to be a load of crap. It would make even more sense that the same thing should apply with relationship "common sense". Especially with limiting beliefs (example: the 6-month doom belief).

    I'm not saying you ought to actively set out to feel everlasting bliss with somebody (or somebodies). But this concept you have that such a thing is impossible, is only as true as you presume it to be.

    Cliffs:

    1. Monogamy by default puts you in this shitty situation where you have a terrible binary: all your eggs in one basket, or none of them in any basket.

    2. Assuming relationships fizzle makes them fizzle. It also changes your course of action so that you have to do all this unnecessary waiting around / hunting.
     

Share This Page