E36 M3 vs B5 S4

Discussion in 'OT Driven' started by red97gst, Aug 22, 2007.

  1. red97gst

    red97gst New Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2005
    Messages:
    1,218
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    NoVA
    Which would you rather have? E36 M3 (specify coupe or sedan) or 2000-2002 Audi S4? Assume it's your only vehicle. Then give me the answer assuming it's your 2nd vehicle (and tell me what your other vehicle is)

    IF youre a BMW or Audi sackrider, please mention so. Then mention WHY you sackride

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  2. art_VW_shark

    art_VW_shark OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2005
    Messages:
    156,666
    Likes Received:
    174
    Location:
    Bosstown
    B5 S4, sorry. The turbo just...the Audi is MUCH more the total package here.
     
  3. E-dub

    E-dub New Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2007
    Messages:
    318
    Likes Received:
    0
    How many miles on the Audi are we talking here.
     
  4. ChosenGSR

    ChosenGSR Mama always said you'd be the chosen one

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    50,971
    Likes Received:
    211
    Location:
    HoCo, MD
    BMW sackrider here, own both Audi and BMW (97 M3, 00' 528i, 00' A4), here is why I sackride BMW:

    Better reliability in general than Audi
    I like "driving" my car, not my car "driving" me, RWD > AWD. Sorry, I don't give a fuck about snow driving with my "track" car.
    BMW feel > Audi fee. BMW feels more nimble, more of a "drivers" car.


    That said, I own a 97 M3 which I track regularly.
     
  5. BavarianMotorWe

    BavarianMotorWe New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    Messages:
    218
    Likes Received:
    0
    Bmw.
    Put them on a strip and see that without the twin turbo Audi would be in dust. How would they finish? 8 times out of 10 right next to each other.

    You want a better package? Turbo the M3.

    Bmw is worthy of everyones sackriding. They deserve it.
    Audi has got them beat on cashing in on your broken ride though.:mamoru:
     
  6. E-dub

    E-dub New Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2007
    Messages:
    318
    Likes Received:
    0
    LOL one of the dumber things I have ever read on the internet.
     
  7. Jajibaji

    Jajibaji Remember, the enemy's gate is down.

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2005
    Messages:
    574
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Inland Empire
    I had a 95 M3 and a 99.5 A4. I'd say for a used car, go bimmer, only because while both cars were probably ridden hard, the M3 probably handles it better. Too many issues for a used twin turbo car which was sooo easy to chip for around $500 bucks.

    I now drive a 07 335, so guess which one I sackride.
     
  8. BavarianMotorWe

    BavarianMotorWe New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    Messages:
    218
    Likes Received:
    0
    The Audi runs the same times as the M3 with the twin turbos. Its just me guessing but I think the Audi wont run the same times without the turbos.

    Maybe I am dumb...
     
  9. E-dub

    E-dub New Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2007
    Messages:
    318
    Likes Received:
    0
    :rofl:

    Show me an S4 without turbos.
     
  10. BavarianMotorWe

    BavarianMotorWe New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    Messages:
    218
    Likes Received:
    0
    It was an example. Saying that the M3 is just as fast and doesn't need turbos. Put a turbo on an M3 and you'd have yourself a mean car. I never said the S4 didn't have a turbo.
     
  11. ChosenGSR

    ChosenGSR Mama always said you'd be the chosen one

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    50,971
    Likes Received:
    211
    Location:
    HoCo, MD
    If you live at the track (which is where many M3s live) you would want to stay away from FI anyway.
     
  12. E-dub

    E-dub New Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2007
    Messages:
    318
    Likes Received:
    0
    Add turbo cost to the M3 and the argument does not hold up.

    I just hate when people say "well without turbo..." No. They are part of the engine.

    I hate S4's with a passion as do I hate almost all VW products and their being proned to disintegration at high mileage. However, I love driving the S4's. I love M3's as well. They are a love-hate vehicle.

    Can't say I am a big fan of high mileage Euro cars due to their high cost of maintenance. I'd get a used Lexus IS300 at sacrifice of performance to avoid dumping $$$ into it.
     
  13. BavarianMotorWe

    BavarianMotorWe New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    Messages:
    218
    Likes Received:
    0
    Once again, I was contrasting the performance aspect of each car. If I had to choose an engine I would choose the one that has no turbo yet same results. Hence, the BMW.

    If money was concerned turbos are a headache. The maintenance required for turbos arn't worth even getting them stock. Unless of course its a diesel. I said put a turbo on the M3 because seriously, who wouldn't want to track drive a turbo charged S52B32.
     
  14. ChosenGSR

    ChosenGSR Mama always said you'd be the chosen one

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    50,971
    Likes Received:
    211
    Location:
    HoCo, MD
    go to bf.c and post that in the track section, you'll see that MOST will recommend to stay NA for track application.
     
  15. BavarianMotorWe

    BavarianMotorWe New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    Messages:
    218
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well I own an E30 thats NA and it needs nothing more. I just figured Id fall a little behind on track times. I wouldn't dare turbo charging it just because of its milage.

    What are the downfalls to turbo charging an E36? Im only guessing it'd be a very fun drive.
     
  16. ChosenGSR

    ChosenGSR Mama always said you'd be the chosen one

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    50,971
    Likes Received:
    211
    Location:
    HoCo, MD
    It's not just e36, FI by default (on average) is less reliable than it's NA counterpart. Being that every track mile equals multiple of street miles, reliability is that much more important on the track.
     
  17. BavarianMotorWe

    BavarianMotorWe New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    Messages:
    218
    Likes Received:
    0
    Makes sence. I wouldn't turbo anything just to turbo it. Too many mechanical and electrical adjustments to do it right.
     
  18. red97gst

    red97gst New Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2005
    Messages:
    1,218
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    NoVA
    sigh...

    i'm wondering if there's ONE stock-turboe'd gas engine in the world besides the 2JZ that people see as reliable...

    I have a 4G63 mitsu motor, have had the car from 60k to now 125k, and the motor still runs strong. the non-motor components are evidence of crappy mitsu bean counters, but the moter is stout.

    The only extra maintenance required for turbo motors is changing the oil every 3-5k with mobil 1, royal purple, or similar synthetic. Turbo systems are not as complicated as they might initially seem, but then again, german electronics are complicated as fuck , so that just makes it that much more difficult. In 4 years I guarantee you'll hear all this whining about how the 335i motor is sooo unreliable, while everyone sackrides it for the time being while they have warranties :greddy:

    The issue with the S4 is that you have to pull the motor to access the turbos. That's the real issue here, and thats why it costs 5-6k to get new turbos.

    Assume the E36 is reasonably stock, as is the S4. S4 has better diverter (bypass) valves, and maybe a cat-back and some suspension. Maybe 90k miles on the vehicle.

    If reliability is a worry, assume you have an aftermarket WARRANTY on the car.


    The S4 has been winning me over due to it being newer for a similar price. It also has Front and Rear side curtain airbags, AWD for those snowboarding trips, and comfort for going on dates, throwing groceries in the backseat, etc.

    The E36 has always been a dream of mine since I was 16, but it would have to be as a 2nd car. THe S4 is versatile enough to use as a daily driver...with potential to run very competitive on a track with about 200lbs in weight reduction, a chip, and coilovers.

    What I"m wondering is if i should just get a 2001ish E46 328i 4door or maybe a E39 540i 6-speed.

    E39 6spd gonna be cheaper to maintain than the S4? surely less things to break of course, but BMW parts are as expesnive if not more than audi..
     
  19. red97gst

    red97gst New Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2005
    Messages:
    1,218
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    NoVA
    Ive been considering the IS300. The resale value is CRAZY those cars are still selling for 15-20k and are over 5 years old in some cases. The inline 6 is smooth but damn it could really use 50 extra hp. Maybe I'll just get one and turbo it and drop the value in half FTL...
     
  20. art_VW_shark

    art_VW_shark OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2005
    Messages:
    156,666
    Likes Received:
    174
    Location:
    Bosstown
    even factory FI?
     
  21. ChosenGSR

    ChosenGSR Mama always said you'd be the chosen one

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    50,971
    Likes Received:
    211
    Location:
    HoCo, MD
    Go ask on bf.c track section :dunno:
     
  22. red97gst

    red97gst New Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2005
    Messages:
    1,218
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    NoVA
    if your car lives on the racetrack you'll want NA just cuz it has less stuff to break...esp. on longer, endurance events. That being said, the FI car will be faster... and you'll have all week in between weekends to change the fluids and check for leaks... You're not going to find many people with Supras, RX7s, and Skylines who decide to run NA motors because it's less to maintain. Piston oil squirters, among other things, are your friend...

    No E30 and E36 guys are running turbos on their track cars cuz they would be retrofitted setups....just like you will find way more honda hatchback racecars at tracks staying NA. Not to mention it's easier to control an NA car around corners...and BMW drivers are all about "balance" and "precision" , AKA things you talk about when your car lacks HP and you're afraid of oversteer...

    JK hahhah a...
     
  23. ChosenGSR

    ChosenGSR Mama always said you'd be the chosen one

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    50,971
    Likes Received:
    211
    Location:
    HoCo, MD
    M3s/M5s hardly lack HP.
     
  24. Peter O'Hanraha-hanrahan

    Peter O'Hanraha-hanrahan OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    10,369
    Likes Received:
    0
    I like my S4, its 6.5 years old and still a lot of fun
     
  25. A4Tuurbo

    A4Tuurbo Audi Crew::DSLR Crew::Indie Crew::Mac Crew::Guitar

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    264
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Scranton, Pa
    I would take the S4 over the M3 simply because I like the S4's looks better as well as the fact that it reacts to mods much better. After a chip you can be at like 320hp and 380tq. Now tell me you can do that to an M3 with $600. Also AWD > RWD unless you track it all the time. If it was an E46 then thats a different story but E36s are FTL I think.
     

Share This Page