FRK Do you think TS's require your permission to live their lives?

Discussion in 'Vaginarium' started by sparklwazngurly, Jul 28, 2009.

  1. sparklwazngurly

    sparklwazngurly New Member

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    I'm still kinda upset over some of the things said in the discrimination post, so I wanted to ask a damn question. In the trans community, if you live your trans life in secret, meaning you transition and no one you currently associate with is aware you were ever FORCED into the box of the wrong gender, then you are said to be living in stealth.

    It almost seems, as if the most people would rather that only the small number of trans folk fortunate enough to be "passable" transition, and live totally in stealth. The down side to this is the well documented violent or extreme social reactions to associates finding out about the individuals "past". This of course leaves the overwhelming majority of trans people with no way to facilitate an attempt to reach a congruency between their gender and sex, if they are not permitted to transition because they don't make the "get in and out of the restroom free" grade.

    So question is: Is this what the hell you want... anyone. Do you prefer someone like me open enough to try and foster some understanding? Or am I just unnecessarily making myself an open target for the bigotry and hate of a closed society we delude ourselves into thinking is "free"? Should we T's start wearing some special armbands or something?

    (If you don't know the difference between sex and gender, http://www.apa.org/topics/transgender.html read a little, please.)

    Okay, I opened the can. Let's hear it.
     
  2. Soybomb

    Soybomb New Member

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    No matter how great and just your cause is, you're always going to find people who won't think or behave logically. You can't expect everyone to agree with your position or to win everyone over. Progress takes time. If you're going to champion a cause, you're going to get some hate for it too.
     
  3. sparklwazngurly

    sparklwazngurly New Member

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    Being sensitive to an issue close to heart, that's something wrong? Feel free not to answer if you don't like it. Has nothing to do with my conviction or comfort with my decision. The question was, in light of the other discussion, I wanna know if people think trans people should be open like I am, or live in stealth. Seeing as how you must be well "passable" (in quotes because I hate the term) to live in stealth, that wouldn't leave other TS's with many options if they didn't fit into that narrow margin.
     
  4. sparklwazngurly

    sparklwazngurly New Member

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    Exactly. I know I am going to take heat for it, because I am open. So I posed the question to the FS (not VAG) who tend to be a few IQ points above and widely more open minded then others, how they feel. It's like a test sample of a specific demographic.
     
  5. sparklwazngurly

    sparklwazngurly New Member

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    Doesn't seem back-handed at all, pretty clear I wanna hear from FS. read the rest of the post
     
  6. sparklwazngurly

    sparklwazngurly New Member

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    I just noticed I didn't finish the thread title though... Do you think TS's need your permission to live their lives in the open? Sorry for that mistake.
     
  7. Fifafever

    Fifafever OT Supporter

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    They should do whatever makes them feel comfortable at the time. It's probably more healthy to be open about it though.

    Also I agree with Babylon, what you wrote there is pretty much the definition of a back-handed insult. If you didn't mean it as so - fine, but I'm sure you recognize how that could be misunderstood by someone.

    To address your last point: no one needs permission to lead the lives the choose to lead as long as their choices don't harm others.
     
  8. sparklwazngurly

    sparklwazngurly New Member

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    Thanks for the post. Do you think choosing to be open and not stealth harms others?
     
  9. FairyTat

    FairyTat Anticipation, the taste of things to cum

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    Sugar, you don't need permission from anyone to live any way you want to. Bigotry and hatred are aimed at many people who live lives outside the mainstream. Unfortunately your particular situation has forced you to ask everyone in your world for permission to legally be who you feel in your heart you already are.

    I have so much empathy (not sympathy) for you and the things you've had to deal with and the future things that you haven't had to face yet. Someday, maybe, people will understand that you have been thru all of this not because you choose it but because living in your former persona was like living a lie.

    Do what I'm willing to bet you've been doing, hold your chin high and be proud that you're brave enough to identify who and what you are no matter what it costs. I'm proud of you.
     
  10. sparklwazngurly

    sparklwazngurly New Member

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    Thanks so much! I do love FS, and am sorry for the back-handedness of my statement. I think anyone that participated in the thread asking for advice on dating a t-girl, understands what I meant, though truly, my horrible slip for using ad hominem and false generalization.

    Sometimes it is so hard to just live. Like the entire bathroom topic. Something so simple is really that complicated? Regardless, thanks not only for your post but also so much for the awesome support!
     
  11. CorpseStreet

    CorpseStreet New Member

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    I think they should do whatever it takes to make the transition easiest within reason. Trans people should be able to live their lives and deal with the transition without others making it more difficult, unfortunately we don't live in a world where this is always a possibility so if the transition is done stealthily so be it. It would be nice of trans people were allowed to develop and figure out who they are in peace but until that's possible do whatever it takes. I personally enjoy how open you are to questions because it gives me a chance to learn more about a demographic that doesn't get that much positive exposure. Of course being open means facing bigotry which sucks. On another note I don't think being open or stealth harms any one though it can deprive some people who want to learn that chance.
     
  12. Fifafever

    Fifafever OT Supporter

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    Most definitely not.
     
  13. sparklwazngurly

    sparklwazngurly New Member

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    Thanks, I am really glad to hear when it is appreciated and benefitted from as I share. I think that both stealth and open carry ups and downs. For me, I just feel that if you have the opportunity AND capability to help, with teaching and sharing, then you have the responsibility to do it, hence I feel responsible to be open and share as I do.
     
  14. Diesel66

    Diesel66 My standards for women is like rent-a-centers stan OT Supporter

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    if you dont realize your lifestyle would come under attack from the vast majority of people, you are a fool. Plus it seems you are more close minded than even the so called "bigots" you point out.



    This goes to everyone:
    do whatever you want, dont expect people to welcome you with open arms.
     
  15. ACLdestroyer

    ACLdestroyer OT Supporter

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    Can we lock this thread? This is not FS material. More like Political Discussion.

    No humans require another humans permission to "Live their lives."
     
  16. Kinks

    Kinks Sup. OT Supporter

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    ^^ as already said, the topic wasn't completely stated. I also think that this thread is relevant to FS and it should remain open and free from personal attacks. If you don't like it, don't participate.

    Personally I belive that if you make a "lifestyle choice" that deviates from what society considers normal you can expect some adverse reaction to it. Hence, sparkl, you should try to realise that not everybody is open-minded and some people will have a problem with you. You may do well to practice stealth around said people, it avoids an uncomfortable situation on both sides. I don't think it's reasonable to only expect an answer from open-minded people, because then you're restricting the field of opinions to those that are more likely to agree with your own (this being FS, you are more likely to get said support anyway).

    The risk of violence comes in where stealth is practiced past the point at which somebody could be considerably upset and angry that they were not aware of the situation. If you talk to somebody in the street for 3 minutes and then go "oh by the way, I'm a trans-sexual" a reasonable person would not have a bad reaction because gender is not relevant to general conversation. If you carried on a sexual relationship with someone and then admitted you were born male then they might be disgusted as a result of their belief they had been sleeping with another genetic male. It doesn't by any means justify violence but that would be a potent trigger for an adverse reaction. Hence my belief is that if you are heading into territory where something becomes relevant you should disclose it at the earliest opportunity. If you are dating someone you should let them know pretty well straight away that you are what you are. If anything it stops both of you from wasting each others' time.
     
  17. suhrim21

    suhrim21 New Member

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    I get ridiculed and torrmented and stereotyped everyday. now I know what I go through is nothing compaired to what you go through, but what is the same is what I have learned. you will never please everyone. the people you do please are the people you can be yourself around and are the people you want around you. Which is why I am on here. The people here are not judgmental, they are openminded and understand what we go through. NEVER be ashamed of who you are. ALWAYS be proud of who you are. As long as you stay true to yourself peoples opinions dont matter. As for the negative comments you did have some, I just wanna offer my two cents worth about that. I have learned if you put others down then Noone is going to stand by your side. Unfortunately with the hatred in this word all of us "Freaks and outcasts" need everyone we can get on our side.
     
  18. Sam Gamgee

    Sam Gamgee Every tool is a weapon if you hold it right. OT Supporter

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    simple answer to your question: no.

    Nobody needs permission to live their lives as they see fit, as long as it is not breaking any laws (pedophelia, etc)

    If other people have an problem with you, it's simply that: Their problem.
     
  19. FairyTat

    FairyTat Anticipation, the taste of things to cum

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    I don't think this thread needs to be locked. It's a valid discussion that is born from a sexual identity issue close to the heart of one of our members. If you don't like the thread or the opinions voiced within then you are free to not read it.
     
  20. sparklwazngurly

    sparklwazngurly New Member

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    Thanks for this. I think some good comments have been made and discussion is being done. I'm happy to see the input and willingness to respond to the topic. Thanks to everyone participating.
     
  21. RougeOgre

    RougeOgre FS Librarian and MOD

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    Neither do I thus far.....
     
  22. P-Nut

    P-Nut Active Member

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    I think Sam said it. Not my words, but wht I was thinking.
     
  23. Abomb

    Abomb New Member

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    /thread
     
  24. KindlyCuddly

    KindlyCuddly Irina Lazareanu

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    lol which is why stealth is awesome~ recommends.
     
  25. PumpScout

    PumpScout New Member

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    Massive lurker here - I'm of the mind that all people should be able to do what makes their lives complete and happy, assuming it doesn't affect the rights of others to do the same. With such a belief, I believe that transgendered folks should certainly be able to live life to the fullest. It's a true shame that anyone is forced to do otherwise in what are supposed to be modern, enlightened times.
     

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