Developing for OS X SUCKS MY ASS

Discussion in 'OT Technology' started by Peyomp, Jul 4, 2006.

  1. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    I was going to roll our app for OS X, but I'm just sick and tired of perl -MCPAN -e 'install XXXXXX' failing all the time.

    Fuck OS X.

    I mean, I like it. But fuck developing for it. I may do my development in OS X inside Eclipse, but I'm doing all execution in SuSE inside Parallels.
     
  2. agent0068

    agent0068 OT Supporter

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    how is it OS X's fault that your chosen IDE sucks?

    for me, Xcode & BBEdit keep me very happy
     
  3. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    This isn't an IDE issue. This is a compilation and package management issue. And yes, it is Apple's fault that support for GNU/FOSS tools is very much inferior to any linux distribution.
     
  4. CompiledMonkey

    CompiledMonkey New Member

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    apt-get ftw?
     
  5. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    First of all, you can't apt-get perl packages. You use the MCPAN command line, which is just as easy. But... they often fail to build. Lots of stuff fails to build on OS X. More than should be the case. fink is outdated. As is darwin ports.

    Actually the package in question failed to build on SuSE as well when I tried. A little coaxing got it going, but my point is that I shouldn't have to coax. And I usually do on OS X. It takes hours to do what often takes seconds or minutes in Linux.

    I'd like to see Apple throw more resources at ports or fink, to keep everything current.
     
  6. agent0068

    agent0068 OT Supporter

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    because apple owes it to you since they're just selling yet another linux, right?

    i just don't get criticisms like this--you have windows users who will bitch and moan that os x doesn't do some windows-centric thing, despite the fact that it doesn't apply. and then you have the linux crowd who complains that it isn't linux. this is a different operating system and the fact that your chief complaint is that what you want to do is done easier in linux says it all (since i'm sure we can all agree that ease of use isn't exactly a strong point for linux). you blame apple that fink and darwinports aren't up to par--both projects that AREN'T apple's responsibility. i'm not trying to be sarcastic, but maybe i'm just missing something here... :dunno:
     
  7. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    Apple owes it to us to support a means of keeping up to date with GNU/BSD tools, since Darwin is a BSD OS.

    Is that complicated for you?
     
  8. skelm

    skelm New Member

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    :werd:
     
  9. turbo91

    turbo91 New Member

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    Apple will gladly keep you up to date with XCode, Cocoa bindings, etc... but I don't think the BSD core and its utilities is their primary development platform or toolchain. *shrug*.
     
  10. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    And yet it is the core of their entire operating system.
     
  11. agent0068

    agent0068 OT Supporter

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    just like they owe you an open kernel, right? they don't owe you shit when it comes to the unix underpinnings. should we be on their case since the included version of Apache or PHP isn't the bleeding-edge latest version? the fact that it's BSD based and that they expose any of it is a courtesy and added bonus, not a promise or an obligation. apple is not catering to a unix crowd and mac os x is not sold as yet-another-unix. it just happens to be one.
     
  12. agent0068

    agent0068 OT Supporter

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    agreed
     
  13. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    Incorrect. OS X Server is sold as a Unix server.

    An operating system maker, especially a SERVER operating system maker, has a responsibility to keep its system up to date. Apple doesn't. This isn't about open/closed source. Its about the tools required to operate a server being out of date.

    And this isn't about Linux. Windows, Linux, Solaris... any Unix, the manufacturers all invest in keeping libraries and tools working with their system. Apple doesn't.

    This sucks. Period. Any company that sells a server platform that doesn't maintain its compatability with the toolsets upon which it is based is a STUPID company, and has an inferior product.
     
  14. agent0068

    agent0068 OT Supporter

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    :rofl: apple does keep its libraries and tools working and up-to-date. the problem here is you think that BSD and unix is apple's toolset. it's not. things like Quicktime, the WindowServer, Cocoa, the Finder, etc--these are apple's bread and butter. this is what they make and what people pay money for. vi, perl, etc are third party goodies not representative of what the majority of apple's targetted crowd is looking for and they're freely available for any OS. i fail to see why apple should give a shit or even come with ANY of it preinstalled. and honestly, if you hate the Mac OS so much and think it's so horrifically inferior, why are you using it?
     
  15. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    Read the thread. I'm not. I switched to Linux.

    Have you ever actually run a server that does real things in a production environment? Obviously you have not. You have to use perl. You have to use the BSD/GNU toolset to keep the system up and running and happy. If you were a system administrator, you would be aware of this.

    The BSD/GNU tools ARE Apple's toolset. You've just never actually interacted with the platform underneath the glitz. Cause you've never actually managed a server.

    What you're essentially saying is that OS X Server is a toy for small businesses, and has no place where using real unix tools is required.

    Which is exactly what I'm saying. Only, I'm disappointed. It could be more.
     
  16. agent0068

    agent0068 OT Supporter

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    mince my words as you will (e.g. i never called it or insinuated that it's a toy). i guess we'll just have to disagree on this one.
     
  17. samm

    samm Next in Line

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    What is the package in question?
     
  18. Peyomp

    Peyomp New Member

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    Task::Catalyst

    One of its dependancies.
     

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