GUN Cooper Challenge: 20 Shots 20 Seconds 20 Inches 1,000 Yards

Discussion in 'On Topic' started by smell my finger, Feb 18, 2004.

  1. smell my finger

    smell my finger strive nonetheless towards beauty and truth,

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    This is from the current Cooper's Commentaries, V-12 #2:

    "Do any of you marksmen think it possible for a man to place 20 shots in a
    20-inch circle in 20 seconds at a 1,000 yards? I posed this question to
    the range masters down at Camp Pendleton many years ago and was told that such a thing was not possible. During much of my life a four-minute mile was deemed to be impossible, to say nothing of motoring around on the surface of the moon.

    "Obviously this rifle challenge is very, very hard. I
    have tried it twice myself and conclude that while the task is not
    impossible, it is nearly so.

    "Therefore, I am undertaking the proposal of a
    perpetual prize in the form of a grand gold cup or bowl to be awarded to
    anyone who can bring off this stuntproperly supervised, of
    course. Administration of the effort will be complicated, but that we can
    handle. I hope to avoid commercialization, but where there is a will there
    is a wayand money in sufficient quantities can provide the will."

    Col. Jeff Cooper





    (shamelessly copied from another board)
     
  2. RealFastV6

    RealFastV6 OMFGh4x0rzZ!!111

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  3. Triad.:

    Triad.: OT Supporter

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    time to get practicing.

    So he is saying that NO ONE has done it? Even professional military marksmen/snipers?

    1000 yards..... CARP!!!! 10 football fields.... unpossible!!!! Imagine the scope....
     
  4. mrbill

    mrbill New Member

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    that's pretty tough. are there any super accurate rifles with the magazine capacity for that? cuz i don't think it could be done if you had to reload that would eat up too much time.
     
  5. footratfunkface

    footratfunkface New Member

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    M1A. AR.

    i think it'd have to be a semi, because recoil, plus time to operate the bolt, plus time to recover after operating the bolt, then take another shot would take longer than a second.


    no, is he saying you could ONLY fire 20 shots, or at least 20 shots? if it's the latter, then a ma-deuce would do the trick, easy. just hold it on there, pop singles really fast, and take the best 20. or, hell, just hold it wide open and spray the target.
     
  6. mrbill

    mrbill New Member

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    :bowdown:
     
  7. Jago

    Jago It helps if you hit it.

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    jesus, thats crazy.
     
  8. smell my finger

    smell my finger strive nonetheless towards beauty and truth,

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    i would assume there is a 20 shot limit, maybe 25 or something :dunno: .. otherwise you could just get a minigun of some type and spay out a couple hundred rounds. im sure 20 of them would land within 20 inches.


    i think the best bet would be a modified 50 caliber rifle with a 20 round mag and a huge muzzle brake.
     
  9. RRTX

    RRTX New Member

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    The 1000 yard part isn't the big deal, it's the 20 rounds in 20 seconds. There are not many rifles that can accurately shoot that far that have a magazine that large. About the minimum size round that is accurate for that distance is .308, .223 won't cut it for 1000 yards.
     
  10. DK

    DK New Member

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    isnt the HK PSG1 supposed to be the most accurate semi-auto sniper rifle around? if any rifle can do that, it surely has to be that one.

    http://www.hkpro.com/psg1.htm

    i am a mediocre rifle shooter, usually getting avergae results on 200 and 300 yards with 7.62 mm rifles, so i guess i dont really need to bother.
     
  11. nycmatt49

    nycmatt49 Guest

    Would certainly need to be semiauto, 20 round mag. I certainly don't think it's impossible, but you might have to keep trying it for the rest of your life before you got all 20....
     
  12. footratfunkface

    footratfunkface New Member

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    au contraire, fine gentleman.

    one of the last two or three 1000 yard matches at camp perry (this is possibly the biggest rifle match in the world, the nationals at camp perry) was won by a marine with an M4, no optics. he was likely using 100 gr. rounds, and taking his sweet time, but he beat all the other guys with whatever the hell they were using.

    edited for my dislexic hands.
     
  13. Jonny Chimpo

    Jonny Chimpo OT Supporter

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    The PSG-1 is an awesome rifle, but not the most accurate semi-auto. Maybe one of the most accurate, but it will vary from rifle to rifle. The PSG-1 has some very stiff competition from the likes of the Walther WA-2000, Barrett M82A1, and the Russian SVD. Then there are the magazine fed bolt actions like the Accuracy International Super Magnum and the Unique Alpine TPG-1.

    After seeing what Jerry Miculek can do with his custom S&W revolver, there's bound to be a human that can do this challenge, but damn it's gonna be hard.
     
  14. RRTX

    RRTX New Member

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    Got a link to some results? I have a hard time believing that a 1000 yard match was won using an M4 with no optics :ugh:
     
  15. DK

    DK New Member

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    i think we can all agree on the fact that not even lee harvey oswald could score 20 HITS in 20 SECONDS on 1000 yards with a bolt action, especially not with a .50 cal rifle.
     
  16. Jonny Chimpo

    Jonny Chimpo OT Supporter

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    Oswald was a pussy
     
  17. footratfunkface

    footratfunkface New Member

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    .2 MOA would be awesome if it were taken at 1000 yards, however, .2 MOA gets bigger as you go out. it'd probably do more like 1-2 MOA at 1000 yards.


    HOWEVER, this would still produce groups within the 20-inch limit, so one of you go buy this thing and give it a shot.


    as for the link to the results of the nationals, i'm still in the process of finding them. the NRA has last year's results, but not '02 or '01, that i can find. it's going to be one of those two years.
     
  18. RealFastV6

    RealFastV6 OMFGh4x0rzZ!!111

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    AWESOME round. Absolutely awesome.
     
  19. RealFastV6

    RealFastV6 OMFGh4x0rzZ!!111

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    I'm under the impression that it doesn't get bigger as you go out, because it's an angle measurement, not a distance measurement.

    2 MOA @ 100 yards = 2"
    2 MOA @ 200 yards = 4"
    2 MOA @ 1000 yards = 20"
     
  20. RealFastV6

    RealFastV6 OMFGh4x0rzZ!!111

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    PS. Before you break out your calculator, yes, I know it's not EXACTLY 1" per Minute of Angle at 100 yards, but it's damn close.
     
  21. footratfunkface

    footratfunkface New Member

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    yes. it's not a constant MOA all the way out. like he said, as you get farther out, the MOA doesn't stay at what it is at 100 yards, because of all the changing variables over the distance.
     
  22. mrbill

    mrbill New Member

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    imo, to even come close to the posted requirements, you can toss out anything other than a semi/auto with no less a magazine capacity of 20 rnds. taking the time to cycle the bolt or reload would(again imo), put the task too far out of reach.
     
  23. footratfunkface

    footratfunkface New Member

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    if you just get an AR that has the weight of a barret, and bipod it, and use 80 gr. rounds in a 1/8 20" or 24" barrel, with a match throated chamber, i think you could do it. if i had the money, i'd certainly give it a shot, that's for sure. it's not impossible, and it'll be done soon.
     
  24. Triad.:

    Triad.: OT Supporter

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    :werd:
     
  25. footratfunkface

    footratfunkface New Member

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    i doubt that even with the heaviest .17 round you could get good ballistic coefficients. it just would be too small, light, and short, and underpowered. the case strength would not handle the pressures that you would need to propel such a heavy round (and it still wouldn't be that heavy) so far. even if you COULD get it that far, you'd have to launch it like artillery.
     

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