CCNA and MCSE certifications not as useful anymore?

Discussion in 'OT Technology' started by ohgod123, Sep 25, 2009.

  1. ohgod123

    ohgod123 OT Supporter

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    I've been reading about MCSE and CCNA certifications and how many companies look to hire those who have these certifications. Before I really put the time into studying for these, I would like to know what you guys think about the current state of IT.

    The reason I'm asking here is because on dice.com(site where IT jobs are posted), the people on the forums are extremely negative. They continually tell people to stay away from IT and that the field is dying. They also keep saying that these certifications are now essentially useless.

    Are these guys just being bitter or is there actually some merit to what they are saying? I don't want to put in hours of time and money to get obtain these certifications only to have them not do much for me.
     
  2. synthetic

    synthetic New Member

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    over saturated job market... must pursue higher degrees now (mce, ccnp-ccie)

    at that, remember proprietary commands for a system that will be obsolete in 3 years
     
  3. FormulaLS1

    FormulaLS1 Member

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    http://www.getccnajobs.com/ lots of jobs for people with CCNAs and experience...

    MCSE is :rolleyes: everyone does Microsoft now a days won't really set you apart from everyone.

    IT isn't going anywhere....with VoIP, the huge push to get all medical records digital and everything else its still growing.

    CCNA -> CCVP and going the voice/networking route might be a solid path...Convergence technology has good demand right now.

    You're still going to need on the job experience to get anywhere in your career though.
     
  4. Vito_Corleone

    Vito_Corleone New Member

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    Obviously IT isn't dying, technology is continuing to grow, new technologies continue to come out.

    I'm a CCNP, certs are not useless, without having the CCNP I wouldn't have gotten my current job. I got my CCNA a little over a year ago, I found a job shortly after. If not for the CCNA I wouldn't have gotten that job either.

    Certs won't get you the job, experience and personality are much bigger factors. Certs help get you the interview and meet the "requirements". Do some searching if you want to see the value of _______ cert. Here's some shit from indeed:

    6,037 hits for CCNA in the US

    3,680 hits for CCNP in the US

    7,937 hits for MCSE in the US


    Obviously these certs aren't useless.
     
  5. Hate Crime

    Hate Crime Don't Hate OT Supporter

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    That's all that needs to be said.
     
  6. Vito_Corleone

    Vito_Corleone New Member

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    If nothing more was said it would imply that certs hold little value, which wasn't my point.
     
  7. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    :rofl: bullshit.

    if they're useless, why is some kind of "certification required" on many/most IT/networking jobs on monster?
     
  8. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    in 3 years the commands may or may not be obsolete, but to get a job TODAY you probably have to know them...........AND, during the time between now and 3 years from now when the proprietary system changes, you'll be changing right along with it.




    your post is like saying a doctor shouldn't learn a medical procedure because in 3 years they'll have a new one. going by that logic, the doctor will NEVER learn to fix that problem.
     
  9. Hate Crime

    Hate Crime Don't Hate OT Supporter

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    Because employers are sick of people who claim to know more about cisco shit than the next guy who is certified, so they hire him and find out he doesnt know shit. Sounds like the problem isnt with the certs, but with the hiring managers.
     
  10. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    I know more than one network admin who had to take a test during the hiring process. One friend called me and said "they handed me a paper and made me fill in the 7 OSI layers and what their function is!"

    he had his ccnp..........he did well filling in the paper, and they offered him the job.

    the "problem" is when people take what's on a resume at face value. if a hiring manager hires someone and later finds out he doens't know shit, I'd be more than happy if BOTH of them were fired.
     
  11. Hate Crime

    Hate Crime Don't Hate OT Supporter

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    Unfortunately, it's way easier to find someone who wants to "work" but won't actually work.
     
  12. als54

    als54 OT Supporter

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    That's the problem with a lot of certs, no experience coupled with going through a boot camp or self study equals a person that simply cannot do the job. I work with a guy that has the certs and even a degree, but NO common sense when it comes to working with users or concern about his actions affecting them...
     
  13. Vito_Corleone

    Vito_Corleone New Member

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    There are 7 layers in the OSI model? I thought there were only 4.:mamoru:

    That's a pretty silly test for a typical CCNP-level job, but at least it's something. Any employer who doesn't require a technical interview deserves to get fucked. I've had interviews with tech question after tech question and I've had some where they just ask if you've worked with xyz technology, but don't ask any questions to verify that you aren't lying when you say yes.

    Again, certs help get you the interview, but that's about where it ends.
     
  14. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OSI_model



    obviously, because you would have failed the OSI question part of the test.
     
  15. FormulaLS1

    FormulaLS1 Member

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    CCNA is 70% theory information that is static and built upon during your career.

    Cisco IOS commands are not going any where and being able to move around a CLI would be beneficial with Juniper, HP, Nortel, and any other networking equipment.

    All of the entry level certs make it hard to judge peoples skill levels....when you get into higher level certs it really sets you apart from others (CCIE, CISSP, JNCIE)

    Certifications are obviously not going to hurt your career....

    I know in my case I used certifications to back up work experience I already had.....When I interviewed for other jobs I would explain the various projects I had worked on but they wanted something additional to back up the knowledge.
     
  16. Vito_Corleone

    Vito_Corleone New Member

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  17. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    or it wasn't funny.
     
  18. Vito_Corleone

    Vito_Corleone New Member

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    :rofl:

    Whatever dude. You're obviously a fucking moron if you think someone can get a CCNP without knowing the OSI model. I think you were just too stupid to realize what I was saying with my unfunny joke.:ugh:
     
  19. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    I actually thought you were enough of an idiot to be confusing OSI with TCP/IP which DOES have 4 layers.

    But then again, you'd have to have some intelligence in the area to have even made that mistake so forgive me for giving you too much credit.
     
  20. Vito_Corleone

    Vito_Corleone New Member

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    :bowrofl:

    It just keeps getting better.

    So we're measuring each other's intelligence now? Anyone who has networking experience and ISN'T a moron, would understand that I was joking about the fact that we, as network guys, don't pay much attention to things above Layer 4. Pardon me for giving you FAR too much credit as an intelligent network person.
     
  21. dave5678

    dave5678 New Member

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    I agree with this statement 100% because I am proof. No certs or degree. I only have Air Force 3c0x1 Tech school from back in 2002+experiance but I was first pick for a GS-11 position in Germany(over 100 canidates for the job) all expense paid move+housing allowance+utilities for 3 years+ possible extensions.
     
  22. Vito_Corleone

    Vito_Corleone New Member

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    Damn man, that's awesome. I think your case is a bit unique with the military experience, hard to compare to the average joe.
     
  23. 7960

    7960 New Member

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    yep.

    and I agree certs wont' get you the job, but there are also plenty of jobs where you won't even get an interview if you don't have the cert.
     
  24. ohgod123

    ohgod123 OT Supporter

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    thanks for all the replies guys. this gives me a lot more confidence in the field now. I certainly understand that certs are just the beginning. I have a degree in Economics from the University of California, San Diego but I'm not sure how much that would help.

    How long did it take you guys to finish your certifications? All the experience I really have is call center experience for a software company and some Geeksquad related experience. I have some internships but they're not really related to IT.
     
  25. Vito_Corleone

    Vito_Corleone New Member

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    You get out what you put in. I got my CCNP about a year after my CCNA, but it can be done faster if your job has a lot of hands on networking tasks. It took a month or so to get the CCNA, it's very very easy. Get some CBTNuggets or Trainsignal videos and start learning.
     

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