GUN Can Someone Double Check This? (Ballistics Experts Only)

Discussion in 'On Topic' started by BajaDak, Mar 27, 2005.

  1. BajaDak

    BajaDak If you have poo......fling it now

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2003
    Messages:
    615
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    <shrug>
    A team member and i were discussing some thing today, and i figured some of the ballistics buff could streach they're mental muscles on this one.

    -Topic of discussion-
    WARNING SHOTS IN IRAQ
    He feels that we should do warning shots into the dirt in front of a vehicle, because you know where the round is going to go. I feel it is the exact opposite, because you never know where a ricochet is going to go, or at what speed.
    I feel that warning shots should be fired into the air, because you may not know where they go, but they will never reach a speed for their mass to inflict harm on someone. Heres the math..

    first with the things we know.....

    there are 5280 feet in a mile
    3600 seconds for an hour
    terminal, gravity induced velicity is 119mph
    so...the speed of a falling-nonpropelled round is 174.5fps
    and in a perfect vaccume, that speed would be reached in 5.41 feet, due to an accelleration rate of 32.2 feet per second per second ( in a perfect vaccume)

    a military issued bullet with 124 grains has a muzzle velocity of 1230.3fps or 838.8mph, just for comparison.
     
  2. soccaian

    soccaian New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2003
    Messages:
    28,859
    Likes Received:
    0
    rounds coming down from the air CAN inflict serious injury, i remember seeing a statistic somewhere saying there are 40 or so injuries from bullets falling from the air per year.
     
  3. 7

    7 First comes smiles, then lies. Last is gunfire.

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2002
    Messages:
    25,055
    Likes Received:
    0
    You don't think a round falling from the air will hurt someone? People get KILLED like that. :ugh:
     
  4. 7

    7 First comes smiles, then lies. Last is gunfire.

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2002
    Messages:
    25,055
    Likes Received:
    0

    And what the hell caliber does this apply to?

    edit: I was thinking rifle, but this has to be pistol.
     
  5. Joe_Cool

    Joe_Cool Never trust a woman or a government. Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2003
    Messages:
    299,205
    Likes Received:
    516
    This part is your error. Terminal velocity is different for different objects. It depends on mass and coefficient of drag. Falling bullets have been measured at around 300 ft/sec, not 119.

    http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a950414b.html
     
  6. Joe_Cool

    Joe_Cool Never trust a woman or a government. Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2003
    Messages:
    299,205
    Likes Received:
    516
    King/Drew medical center in L.A. said that between 1985 and 1992 they treated 118 people for falling bullet injuries, including 38 deaths.

    From the same link I posted above.
     
  7. Raithan

    Raithan :wackit:

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2002
    Messages:
    906
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    You both have it wrong. To me a warning shot is when the first fucker in their line goes down. It's a warning to all the others. ;)

    j/k of course...






    sort of..
     
  8. Bigsnake

    Bigsnake OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2003
    Messages:
    34,557
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Baton Rouge
    They always have stuff on the news hear around new years and fourth of july to not shoot guns up in the air because the falling bullets kill. I remember awhile ago some people were walking and some girl got hit with a falling bullet and died. It was all over the news.
     
  9. Clingman

    Clingman Clingman runs Bartertown.

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2004
    Messages:
    2,731
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Thunderdome
    Depending on location, I'd rather risk firing a few rounds out into the desert than risk bouncing/splattering rounds into an innocent car. Of course, it would be about 3 seconds after the warning shots that the car got shot to pieces. You gotta respect the guys over there who have to make that decision every day :cool:
     
  10. footratfunkface

    footratfunkface New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2002
    Messages:
    5,844
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Covington, GA
    The advantage of warning shots into the dirt in front of them is that they can visually realize that they are being shot toward due to the sound and the dust cloud. It can result in the round still continuing forward, though, and probably will if you're not shooting into the dirt right in front of you. They could still be struck by the round or its fragments.
     
  11. htex1004

    htex1004 New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2003
    Messages:
    220
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    if it were sand i don't think it'd be that bad but clay and hard packed stuff...... dunno
     
  12. A96HondaAccordCoupeEX

    A96HondaAccordCoupeEX Silver Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2000
    Messages:
    37,970
    Likes Received:
    18
    Location:
    CA
    Put 1 through the windshield. I'm sure they wont mistaken it for a rock chip :mamoru:
     
  13. spankaveli

    spankaveli OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2002
    Messages:
    16,466
    Likes Received:
    6
    Location:
    LA. State, not City.
    :rofl: @ a falling bullet won't inflict harm.
     
  14. atomlowe

    atomlowe meh....member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2003
    Messages:
    1,892
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Vancouver
  15. BajaDak

    BajaDak If you have poo......fling it now

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2003
    Messages:
    615
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    <shrug>
    well it seems that my question was pointed in the right direction and is going up to the MArine Corps Warfighting Lab. seems we have no set SOP for this kind of thing, since Marines aim to kill not warn or get attention. The main points that have been discussed is that a falling 9mm NATO round will hurt or injure, but not kill, but a rifle round, with its ballistic co-efficeint, can build up enough speed to kill someone.
     
  16. Joe_Cool

    Joe_Cool Never trust a woman or a government. Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2003
    Messages:
    299,205
    Likes Received:
    516
    You might want to tell this to the trauma centers that wrap bodies killed by falling handgun bullets.
     
  17. spankaveli

    spankaveli OT Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2002
    Messages:
    16,466
    Likes Received:
    6
    Location:
    LA. State, not City.
    yep
     

Share This Page